Paris 2024 | Olympics

[Angela Channing]

Well, this is a fucking shitshow - apparently someone thought it was a good idea to allow males to compete against women in one of the most physical contact sports there is where raw strength absolutely matters: boxing.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1818959981527417058

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1818961378780094862

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1818963023094026248

Congrats to the people arranging this competition since this will now backfire against everyone involved and overshadow everything else!

Imane Khelif is not a trans athlete, she has always been a female and her gender has never been the issue. She was born with a medical condition which causes her testosterone levels to be naturally elevated and that was the reason for her previous ineligibility. It's the same medical condition that the runner Caster Semenya has. Maybe the International Olympic Committee needs to look at setting an upper limit for testosterone levels in female boxers beyond which they become ineligible but to suggest Imane Khelif is a man or a trans man is not helpful.

 

[Whovian]

Looks like online is flooded with the usual slowmo videos of the racewalk to claim all these professional athletes are cheats when the rule is to the naked eye. Disappointing.

Brian Pinta of Ecaudor wins the men's race with a time of 1:18 : 54
Yang Jiuya of China wins the women's race with a time of 1:25:54

 

[CeeCee72]

Imane Khelif is not a trans athlete, she has always been a female and her gender has never been the issue. She was born with a medical condition which causes her testosterone levels to be naturally elevated and that was the reason for her previous ineligibility. It's the same medical condition that the runner Caster Semenya has. Maybe the International Olympic Committee needs to look at setting an upper limit for testosterone levels in female boxers beyond which they become ineligible but to suggest Imane Khelif is a man or a trans man is not helpful.

Thank you. I read the same, but MSM is determined to lable her as trans. Makes for more controversy.

 

[CeeCee72]

For a few minutes, it looked like the rest of the world was catching up with Simone Biles. The floor exercise made us all realize that was quite the case yet.

Congrats to the GOAT.

 

[Angela Channing]

For a few minutes, it looked like the rest of the world was catching up with Simone Biles. The floor exercise made us all realize that was quite the case yet.

Congrats to the GOAT.

It's an astonishing achievement because she is quite old for a top gymnast and to win a gold medal for the best all round female gymnast as a 27 year old mother really is amazing.

 

[tommie]

Thank you. I read the same, but MSM is determined to lable her as trans. Makes for more controversy.

We don't know exactly what condition Imane Khalif has, but the low odds are that it's similar to Caster Semenya - namely a condition that causes blockage of DHT hormone under the development, which can cause the genitalia at birth to resemble female genitalia and thus gets mis-sexed. However, they still have XY-chromosomes, internal testicles, their body still produces testosterone and will be drawn towards developing as male, which will become quite apparent during puberty. For all intents and purposes they're biologically males who can't process a specific hormone (DHT).

Unfortunately, I think some countries, especially those that don't have a lot of female athletes for obvious reasons, use this loophole as they'll have been mis-sexed at birth, thus officially "females". But the likelihood is that even in Algeria they would've been able to diagnose this condition during puberty because it would've been obvious, or at the very least when Khalif started doing professional boxing and failed sex tests.

TL;DR - Khalif likely isn't female with "unusually" high testosterone levels - they're male with normal levels of testosterone. IOC should've never allowed this to happen as it does a disservice to everyone involved.

 

[Whovian]

It never truly feels like an Olympics until we get some track events. Interesting watching the early rounds of the women's 100m this morning with one athlete Marie-Josée Ta Lou Smith of the Ivory Coast getting a flying 10.87 in her heat. Also watched the preliminary rounds which were full of no-hopers allowed to participate to give smaller countries some representation under 'universality' rules - a system that should be scrapped in my opinion.

Was as always interesting watching the early decathlon events - the idea of doing 1 of the events they have to compete in seems hard enough - never mind all 10 of them.

1500m heats were a bit of disappointing with relative slow pace in all of them, hopefully that'll change for the semi-finals in a couple of days.

Attention now turns to the two heats of the women's 5,000m at 17:10 and the men's 10,000m - closing the day of at 20:20.

 

[Angela Channing]

We don't know exactly what condition Imane Khalif has, but the low odds are that it's similar to Caster Semenya - namely a condition that causes blockage of DHT hormone under the development, which can cause the genitalia at birth to resemble female genitalia and thus gets mis-sexed. However, they still have XY-chromosomes, internal testicles, their body still produces testosterone and will be drawn towards developing as male, which will become quite apparent during puberty. For all intents and purposes they're biologically males who can't process a specific hormone (DHT).

Unfortunately, I think some countries, especially those that don't have a lot of female athletes for obvious reasons, use this loophole as they'll have been mis-sexed at birth, thus officially "females". But the likelihood is that even in Algeria they would've been able to diagnose this condition during puberty because it would've been obvious, or at the very least when Khalif started doing professional boxing and failed sex tests.

TL;DR - Khalif likely isn't female with "unusually" high testosterone levels - they're male with normal levels of testosterone. IOC should've never allowed this to happen as it does a disservice to everyone involved.

This is not the case. She was assigned as a female at birth, she has female genitalia, she has a female birth certificate and has lived her entire life as a woman. She is a woman.

Assigning gender purely based on sex chromosomes is problematic because how would you classify someone with Klinefelter syndrome, i.e./ born with XXY chromosomes, for example?

There may be good reasons why she should not be able to compete in a woman's boxing contest but that doesn't mean she is not a woman.

 

[CeeCee72]

This is not the case. She was assigned as a female at birth, she has female genitalia, she has a female birth certificate and has lived her entire life as a woman. She is a woman.

Assigning gender purely based on sex chromosomes is problematic because how would you classify someone with Klinefelter syndrome, i.e./ born with XXY chromosomes, for example?

There may be good reasons why she should not be able to compete in a woman's boxing contest but that doesn't mean she is not a woman.

It's scary how quickly the "anti woke" crowd jumped in and declared her to be a trans female. The lie has spread so far and wide that I don't think the record can ever be set straight. Meanwhile, the real issue (does she have a competitive advantage due to her testosterone level) has been lost and isn't being addressed at all.

 

[CeeCee72]

You know, this whole Olympics has felt "off" to me. The controversies are eclipsing the games. Between the opening ceremony kerfuffle, the boxing situation, the contaminated water, the athletes complaining about the conditions in the village....

Seems like we are focusing less on the athletes and more on the problems.

 

[Angela Channing]

You know, this whole Olympics has felt "off" to me. The controversies are eclipsing the games. Between the opening ceremony kerfuffle, the boxing situation, the contaminated water, the athletes complaining about the conditions in the village....

Seems like we are focusing less on the athletes and more on the problems.

I know what you mean but the Olympics has always had controversies. Meanwhile, Simome Bikes erased the memory of the Tokyo Olympics by winning gold medals, Andy Murray retired from competitive tennis with a creditable run in the men's doubles, Leon Marchand has become a new fan favourite in the swimming and Egyptian fencer Nada Havez won her first match while being 7 months pregnant. There have been so many great stories associated with the Games that I think Paris 2024 is going to be remembered for positive things.

 

[Barbara Fan]

However, they still have XY-chromosomes, internal testicles, their body still produces testosterone and will be drawn towards developing as male, which will become quite apparent during puberty.

And they shouldnt be allowed to complete in womans sport FULL STOP

I am so with Sharon Davies and JK Rowling on that one - its so unfair

 

[Angela Channing]

And they shouldnt be allowed to complete in womans sport FULL STOP

I am so with Sharon Davies and JK Rowling on that one - its so unfair

What do you think should be the criteria for disqualification? Not having a cervix? Imane Khelif has a cervix. Not having gone through male puberty? Imane Khelif hasn't gone through male puberty. Not only having 2 X chromosomes? What about women with 3 X chromosomes or XXY or XO?

What specifically are you objecting too?

 

[CeeCee72]

What do you think should be the criteria for disqualification? Not having a cervix? Imane Khelif has a cervix. Not having gone through male puberty? Imane Khelif hasn't gone through male puberty. Not only having 2 X chromosomes? What about women with 3 X chromosomes or XXY or XO?

What specifically are you objecting too?

All this.

After learning the truth about this boxer, I don't see why she should be barred from competition. So, her physical condition gives her an advantage. Seems to be like Micheal Phelps wing span and ridiculously long arms have him an advantage. A 7 foot basketball player has a huge advantage over a 6 foot player. The physical build of both Martina and Serena have them both an advantage over their competition. There's simply no way to give every athlete the same advantage (or lack thereof).

 

[Frank Underwood]

It's scary how quickly the "anti woke" crowd jumped in and declared her to be a trans female. The lie has spread so far and wide that I don't think the record can ever be set straight. Meanwhile, the real issue (does she have a competitive advantage due to her testosterone level) has been lost and isn't being addressed at all.

As you previously pointed out, the MSM deserves a lot of the blame for that. They clutch their pearls over "misinformation," yet they're one of the biggest purveyors of it.

Of course, another reason people jumped to conclusions is because the woke have been pushing for trans athletes to be classified the same as cis-gender athletes.

This particular case turned out to be more complex than originally thought. They'll likely need to reevaluate their guidelines since this appears to be uncharted territory.

 

[Angela Channing]

All this.

After learning the truth about this boxer, I don't see why she should be barred from competition. So, her physical condition gives her an advantage. Seems to be like Micheal Phelps wing span and ridiculously long arms have him an advantage. A 7 foot basketball player has a huge advantage over a 6 foot player. The physical build of both Martina and Serena have them both an advantage over their competition. There's simply no way to give every athlete the same advantage (or lack thereof).

This is such a great point. Every now and then life throws up an individual who just by chance genetics has physical attributes which make them faster, stronger or more powerful than their contemporaries. That doesn't make them "a cheat", as some people have been calling Imane Khelif, it just makes her different.

It's actually quite heart-breaking to think of all the hate and discrimination she has received over the years just because she doesn't conform to some people's idea of what is a woman and now she is being made the centre of a media storm at a time when she needs to focus on her boxing. How people like JK Rowling have hijacked this story to promote their anti-trans rhetoric when this boxer isn't even trans is frankly a disgrace. She is a beautiful child of God and we should be trying to make the world a safer place for people like her and not making them a subject of hate.

It's perfectly legitimate for the Olympic authorities to review their eligibility rules in the future to ensure that the contest is fair for all but it needs to be done in a way that is respectful and fair to all woman and not just those that JK Rowling and her hate mob consider to be women.

 

[Rove]

I'm loving this...

 

[Angela Channing]

I'm loving this...

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Australia are always particularly strong at swimming, diving and and other water based sports so I'm not surprised to see them so high in the medals table. The second week when the focus shifts more to track and field sports is when they do less well.

For me, the biggest surprise is how well France is doing, even with home advantage. I'm so pleased for them.

 

[Angela Channing]

I can't explain how happy I am for Simone Biles, what an absolute star and another gold medal for her at Paris. Hers is one of the great stories of this Olympics.

 

[CeeCee72]

I can't explain how happy I am for Simone Biles, what an absolute star and another gold medal for her at Paris. Hers is one of the great stories of this Olympics.

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I am so thrilled for her. And for Rebecca of Brazil! She is so close to Simone and killing every routine!