Question about the Last Season

Jimmy Todd

Telly Talk Star
LV
4
 
Messages
2,917
Reaction score
5,802
Awards
8
Location
United States
Member Since
2019
This has probably been addressed before, but I have a question about the Mary Robeson storyline. Why exactly did Greg seem to step back from the whole affair? I remember a final scene in an episode in which Mary comes home and finds Greg sitting in her apartment. If I recall correctly, in the next episode he tells her he can make her disappear. Then that's it, and it has no effect on her. Greg has nothing to do with this story, despite Meg being his daughter. Mack asks Claudia for a loan to pay off Mary, but I don't remember him asking Greg for any help.
Is there a scene I don't remember that she's some light on this aspect of Mary trying to take Meg from Mack and Karen?
 

valkaren

Telly Talk Member
LV
0
 
Messages
26
Reaction score
90
Awards
1
Location
London
Member Since
2003
It's funny you write about this, because I have started watching S14 and have just watched the episodes you describe. The storyline hasn't concluded yet so I will keep my eyes peeled when it does to see if I can answer your question.

Overall though, the Mary storyline is interesting, but very intricate and appears to change direction more often then not as the writers move their chess pieces to line up to the series finale - there is a sense it was not fully planned out from beginning to end before it got going and therefore, it's not the most easy story to recap. E.G. Mary's own spin on her character changes about 32 times, which in turn changes the dynamics of the plot episode to episode. Then there is the complication with the brother, who I can't remember for the life of me how he was involved with Val's kidnapping and Treadwell.... I guess it doesn't matter when your in the thick of it, as episode to episode, it's a decent story and a wonderful one for Karen and Mack to shine after being misused the year before.
 

Daniel Avery

Admin
LV
6
 
Messages
7,366
Reaction score
13,261
Awards
16
Location
Sunny South Florida
Member Since
June 10, 2000
I'm going to write this as if you have already watched the final season...so if you don't want spoilers, pretend not to see this post.

[polite spoiler space]



So anyway....the reason Greg seems to disappear from the plotline in season 14 has to do with Mary's (actually Loretta's) true motives for what she was up to. She didn't care about Meg in the slightest. "Wanting to visit/know her granddaughter" was the pretext for worming her way into the MacKenzies' lives (especially since Meg was not really her granddaughter, but her grand-niece). Mack developed another of his hero complexes, trying to solve "The Mary Problem" all by himself (not even letting Karen help, for the most part) with one ill-conceived scheme after another. Even if he had been in the market for assistance, Greg was one of the last people he would have asked since they were so estranged at that point. I'm sure all the people arrayed against the MacKenzies in this plotline (not only Loretta and Joe, but Treadwell and the big boss Abby) were counting on Mack NOT getting Greg involved, since like you said, he could just "make her disappear" like he did before. I'm sure Loretta did not need to be told twice to steer clear of Greg. I assume the main reason they had that scene was just to make Greg look like a prime suspect when she turned up dead.

Loretta and Joe had been hired by Treadwell/Abby to distract the MacKenzies and keep them from being any sort of help to Paige with Sumner Group issues. Abby's plans to take over TSG hinged on Greg continuing his self-imposed exile from the company, since having Mack/Karen, Paige, and Claudia co-running things made the company ripe for a takeover. Greg had been trying very hard to distance himself from Meg and her parents, so the four of them were not interacting mostly by Greg's choice. Greg probably did not know what Loretta and Joe were up to earlier in the season since he'd relocated to Montana, and Mack's secretive scheming against Loretta kept most everyone (not just Greg) in the dark.

Then there is the complication with the brother, who I can't remember for the life of me how he was involved with Val's kidnapping and Treadwell....
Val went to Florida to follow up on some information about the real Mary Robeson (though she did not know at the time that Loretta was not the real Mary). Val discovered the real Mary had died in childbirth (we assume giving birth to Laura), and that her sister Loretta was impersonating her. Someone in Florida alerted Joe that Val was snooping around their family history, so it was decided to kidnap Val (Abby would never have sanctioned Val's murder) in order to keep her from exposing Loretta and Joe's scheme, since it was integral to Treadwell's over-arching plot to take over the Sumner Group. At first it appeared the man and woman holding Val hostage--friends of Joe's who were being paid off by Treadwell--were only going to hold her as long as it took for the takeover to occur, but then Gary "found" them and caused the car accident that made it appear Val had died, when in fact the two who died were the kidnappers. I assume this is when Val escaped, slowly making her way back to KL in disguise since she thought Treadwell would send more goons to recapture her. In the meantime, Joe killed Loretta, then one of Treadwell's goons killed Joe (so much for honor among thieves) and other seemingly unrelated characters (Nick, Vanessa) were revealed to be participants in this umbrella plot.
 

Willie Oleson

Telly Talk Schemer
LV
8
 
Messages
18,832
Reaction score
32,278
Awards
22
Location
Plotville, Shenanigan
Member Since
April 2002
While all of that makes perfect sense, I also feel it only makes sense if you know the whole story - and that's not the same as watching the story unfold episode by episode.
I, too, sometimes struggled to connect the dots, especially the Mary/Mary's brother/Nick/Val combination.
It didn't bother me very much because it was the last season anyway, but I could have enjoyed it a little more if it hadn't been so all over the place.
 

Daniel Avery

Admin
LV
6
 
Messages
7,366
Reaction score
13,261
Awards
16
Location
Sunny South Florida
Member Since
June 10, 2000
I think they were simply following the tradition of soap "umbrella stories" that involve a large amount of characters (if not all): dropping hints and leaving plenty of questions hanging in order to keep the viewer guessing (and watching) up to the end. Having smaller stories/arcs playing out while advancing a larger story is the best way to ration out the hints and questions, but unless the smaller stories end up linking together in a logical (smart) way, the smaller plots will seem like Red Herrings. When a storyline is projected to unfold over an entire season (in this case, nineteen episodes), they can't reveal everything right away. One has to be patient and observant, trying to separate the "real" plot points from the tangents designed to fake-out the viewer. But yes, if there had been a lot of fake-outs that went nowhere and pointless scenes, then that plot would have been frustrating. As it was, the story had been conceived for a 22-episode season but had to be boiled down to nineteen episodes per CBS, which meant they had fewer opportunities for tangents and scenes that did not actively advance the umbrella plot. They still ended up with time-wasters like that plot with Anne, Nick, and the racehorse, but overall they did a good job of keeping focused. The downside, I guess is that the viewer also had to be highly focused on what was going on in every scene, because you might miss something important if you took a simple potty break.
 

Julia's Gun

Telly Talk Fan
LV
1
 
Messages
453
Reaction score
1,959
Awards
7
Location
England
Member Since
Oct 2011
Val was meant to be dead initially wasn't she, since Joan had left the show for good? I thought they made up the plot about it being the kidnapper's wife who died after Joan agreed to come back for the finale.
 

tommie

Telly Talk Hero
LV
3
 
Messages
6,121
Reaction score
8,654
Awards
9
Location
Sweden
Member Since
I dunno
When did they decide it was definitively the final season either way? I imagine it must've been sometime in February/March, hence the big break between episode 17 and the two hour season finale? I'm not sure if they always planned for Abby to be behind orchestrating all of this as I can't imagine them paying for Donna Mills to return if it wasn't for the finale. I'm sure they must've thought up an alternative resolution to everything that would potentially lead it into season 15.
 

Daniel Avery

Admin
LV
6
 
Messages
7,366
Reaction score
13,261
Awards
16
Location
Sunny South Florida
Member Since
June 10, 2000
CBS was dangerously close to cancelling KL at the end of season 13 when the producers proposed the fourteenth season (with the boatload of cost-cutting measures). One of the main reasons CBS took them up on the offer was because it was understood to be the final season--there was no way the show could have squeezed any more money out of the budget without seriously compromising the quality of the show. So people knew it was "the end" even before season 14 started filming. Once it became known that the show was ending after that season---and Joan Van Ark's failed pilot had been buried in the backyard--both JvA and Donna Mills expressed interest in a return engagement. From what I recall written about at the time, JvA expressed interest in having Val return much sooner than the final episodes....but they simply could not write her back in because the main story (with so many interwoven issues with stories as well as budget) was already written and planned out. I would assume they probably did not have the money to pay for her return, either, since they'd twisted themselves into pretzels to afford having limited appearances of the other regulars.
The producers did not want the show to end on a lackluster cliffhanger, so they jumped through significant financial hoops to make the final renewal happen. They cut the number of episodes (19 as opposed to 22) and came up with that plan to have the main stars sit out a certain number of episodes. The reason for the big gap between episodes 17 and 18 was because the season had to air over seven or eight months; back then, everyone expected shows to begin in September or October and end in late May. They started season 14 on the final Thursday of October (going into November Sweeps) and after that March-to-May break, they aired those final two episodes in mid-May.
 

Seaviewer

Telly Talk Champion
LV
7
 
Messages
4,862
Reaction score
8,447
Awards
16
Location
Australia
Member Since
14 September 2001
I could never understand why she didn't say she was Meg's great aunt in the first place. It really makes little difference but they acted as if that was no relation at all, which would have made more sense plotwise.
 

Daniel Avery

Admin
LV
6
 
Messages
7,366
Reaction score
13,261
Awards
16
Location
Sunny South Florida
Member Since
June 10, 2000
The first time Greg met Loretta (claiming to be Mary) was shortly after Laura died, in an off-camera encounter. She showed up at the Sumner ranch claiming that Laura had had an affair with her son, and that Meg was the product of that affair. Obviously this was not a very clever lie, and Greg pulled some strings to get her sent to jail for some reason (I forget what it was, exactly). He was a mess after Laura died, as we recall, and he didn't have the patience to play cat-and-mouse with yet another scam artist. None of this played out on screen, though--we only learn of this first, sloppy attempt at a shakedown later on. Greg mentions this initial encounter after her return to stir up further trouble. One assumes that Treadwell did some research and found out how Greg had Loretta thrown in jail, then learned how she was related to Meg via Laura and enlisted her to take another stab at causing trouble. Heck, Abby might have learned about "Mary" during her brief marriage to Greg. In Loretta's original attempt at conning Greg, she likely just assumed Greg would give her some money to go away, not expecting he would have her hauled off to jail. So she was justifiably miffed at Greg but also smart enough to know better than to challenge him directly.
 
Last edited:

Jimmy Todd

Telly Talk Star
LV
4
 
Messages
2,917
Reaction score
5,802
Awards
8
Location
United States
Member Since
2019
Thanks for all the responses. KL's final season was very good, especially when you consider how long the show had been on the air. It's just the Mary Robeson-Greg Sumner connection always seemed a bit of a fumble, inho.
Still, as @valkaren said, it was a great arc for Mack and Karen. I actually felt sympathy for Mack when he fell prey to Claudia deceptions
Also, having Karen stay with Diana and bringing back the original actress was a nice touch.
 

TJames03

Banned
LV
0
 
Messages
1,902
Reaction score
780
Awards
4
Location
California
JVA def left the show and Val was dead. There was supposed to be a scene where you actually see Val die in the car crash, but JVA nixed it. Yes, Val was dead until it was announced that KL had been (mercifully!) cancelled.

How could Laura’s mother die in childbirth with her when Laura mentioned taking care of all her unseen brothers and sisters? That’s not a job the youngest child usually does.
 

Seaviewer

Telly Talk Champion
LV
7
 
Messages
4,862
Reaction score
8,447
Awards
16
Location
Australia
Member Since
14 September 2001
JVA def left the show and Val was dead. There was supposed to be a scene where you actually see Val die in the car crash, but JVA nixed it. Yes, Val was dead until it was announced that KL had been (mercifully!) cancelled.
JvA was asked to come back for the death scene but refused. Thankfully.
How could Laura’s mother die in childbirth with her when Laura mentioned taking care of all her unseen brothers and sisters? That’s not a job the youngest child usually does.
It was established early on that Laura was adopted as a baby.
 

valkaren

Telly Talk Member
LV
0
 
Messages
26
Reaction score
90
Awards
1
Location
London
Member Since
2003
It only yesterday occurred to me, while reading Ann Marcus' autobiography (the Head Writer of S14) that the "Val is missing" story arc at the top of the season was designed to give Joan Van Ark the required 3-4 episodes off that was required for all principals to align to the budget cuts agreed for the show to be renewed.

The intent obviously was that Gary would find Val alive in Florida, and they would return home to the cul-de-sac together. This of course changed when JVA decided not to return, at that point this story was already mapped out so they simply changed it from Gary finding Val, to the car chase and subsequent 'death'.
 

Daniel Avery

Admin
LV
6
 
Messages
7,366
Reaction score
13,261
Awards
16
Location
Sunny South Florida
Member Since
June 10, 2000
Except I do not recall it "established early on" that she was adopted. I think that was a ret-con they came up with long after Laura died. I was led to believe Laura died believing Hank and his wife (and the siblings mentioned but never seen) were her biological family. I recall her telling newborn Meg that she was "a fourth generation redhead," which would be an odd thing to say if she never knew her real mother/grandmother/etc. from the Robeson family, much less what their hair colors were. And if she HAD known anything about a biological family other than her own, she would have known the real Mary had died in childbirth and likely told others (like Greg, Richard, perhaps Karen or Valene). But Valene shared the story of Laura being adopted (in the season 13 finale) with Karen via phone from Florida as if it was news she had recently uncovered that Karen needed to hear.
 
Last edited:

Seaviewer

Telly Talk Champion
LV
7
 
Messages
4,862
Reaction score
8,447
Awards
16
Location
Australia
Member Since
14 September 2001
I must be misremembering. In fact, over the weekend I was wondering why they never did anything with it while Laura was alive . A story about Laura searching for her birth mother - or vice versa - would have seemed an obvious thing to do. Your account makes more sense.
 

Daniel Avery

Admin
LV
6
 
Messages
7,366
Reaction score
13,261
Awards
16
Location
Sunny South Florida
Member Since
June 10, 2000
In their haste to shove Constance McCashin out the door, they didn't even mention anyone from her (assumed) biological family. They'd never stated in the dialogue that her father Hank had passed away, so in theory he was still alive out there. She'd mentioned having several siblings but they'd never followed up on that (in much the same way we knew Mack had a sister but never met her), so I guess the writers decided it would be too little, too late to "meet" one or two of them. The funeral was off-screen, which is the traditional way soaps cover "out-of-town relatives" supposedly visiting to pay their respects, but the wake wasn't some "limited attendance" affair that would be off-limits to Laura's relatives. Greg had the means (a corporate jet!) to make sure anyone in Laura's family back east who wanted to attend could get there. But like I said, this was the writers' giving the character and the actress the bum's rush, so it's little wonder no one was there to represent the Murphy side of the family.
 

tommie

Telly Talk Hero
LV
3
 
Messages
6,121
Reaction score
8,654
Awards
9
Location
Sweden
Member Since
I dunno
In their haste to shove Constance McCashin out the door, they didn't even mention anyone from her (assumed) biological family. They'd never stated in the dialogue that her father Hank had passed away, so in theory he was still alive out there. She'd mentioned having several siblings but they'd never followed up on that (in much the same way we knew Mack had a sister but never met her), so I guess the writers decided it would be too little, too late to "meet" one or two of them. The funeral was off-screen, which is the traditional way soaps cover "out-of-town relatives" supposedly visiting to pay their respects, but the wake wasn't some "limited attendance" affair that would be off-limits to Laura's relatives. Greg had the means (a corporate jet!) to make sure anyone in Laura's family back east who wanted to attend could get there. But like I said, this was the writers' giving the character and the actress the bum's rush, so it's little wonder no one was there to represent the Murphy side of the family.

To be fair, a lot of families that live in different parts of a country ends up doing their own memorial services, especially if there are elderly relatives involved that aren't prone to traveling so that would be the easiest explanation for it. It's one of those things they could've thrown in if they had put more thought into it (ie a throw away line like "Laura's family back east are having their own memorial service today"), but as you said they rushed her exit as they needed to make budget cuts rather than really thinking everything through.
 
Top