Was Victoria Principal right to speak out

[Kenny Coyote]

Patrick's return from the dead basically killed the original show, so why would anyone want to take that risk again? I also don't think Victoria would ever allow herself to be used in a lie like that either - it's a deception that works negatively and Victoria is far more about positivity, so I think they would have had a very tough job persuading her about that.

We saw Bobby die. We never saw Pam die. That's the difference.

Since you brought it up though, I didn't like that they brought Bobby back after he died and then told us it was all a dream. That was stupid. But, it didn't have nearly the negative effect I would have thought it had. If you look at the ratings, Dallas only lost a very small percentage of its viewers after they brought Bobby back. Dallas dropped from a 18.8 to a 18.6 in the ratings. That's not "killing" the show; it's a barely perceptible drop. Dallas lost a lot more viewers after Bobby "died" - they went from a 21 rating in season 8 to an 18.8 for season 9. That shows how well liked the character was.

Regarding the idea I had for bringing Pam back, do you really consider that lying to the audience? Lying to the audience is promising something and then not delivering. You're lying to the audience when you're ripping them off. This would have been to surprise the audience in a positive way. You can call it a "deception" if you want, but it's something they'd have done to give the audience even more value than they expected. Why would anyone have had a problem with that?

 

[pete lashmar]

We saw Bobby die. We never saw Pam die. That's the difference.

Since you brought it up though, I didn't like that they brought Bobby back after he died and then told us it was all a dream. That was stupid. But, it didn't have nearly the negative effect I would have thought it had. If you look at the ratings, Dallas only lost a very small percentage of its viewers after they brought Bobby back. Dallas dropped from a 18.8 to a 18.6 in the ratings. That's not "killing" the show; it's a barely perceptible drop. Dallas lost a lot more viewers after Bobby "died" - they went from a 21 rating in season 8 to an 18.8 for season 9. That shows how well liked the character was.

Regarding the idea I had for bringing Pam back, do you really consider that lying to the audience? Lying to the audience is promising something and then not delivering. You're lying to the audience when you're ripping them off. This would have been to surprise the audience in a positive way. You can call it a "deception" if you want, but it's something they'd have done to give the audience even more value than they expected. Why would anyone have had a problem with that?

Ratings may have just dipped, but the show lost it's integrity, it lost the viewer's trust and it then lost key cast members -Bobby's return was definitely where it all started going Pete Tong and couldn't turn it around.

I'm all for not revealing spoilers and giving viewers a great mystery to solve, but the suggestion that you use media outlets to report false information in an effort to drive up publicity is very wrong IMO.

 

[Piggyrella Sanderson]

​

 

[Pamela_E]

If Pam's death was merely the means to which Christopher got his shares, why did Cidre say she would have let the mystery surrounding Pam continue for years? That gave me the impression that she changed course only after VP's statement because fans knew she wouldn't be returning.

Victoria's statement had nothing to do with the plot outcome. Her statement came after the plot was filmed. I have no idea what she meant, maybe she was just unhappy with VP at the time so said that.

 

[pete lashmar]

I truly believe that having lost Larry CC knew that she needed something big for the following season, but her plan backfired massively because I think she genuinely believed that Victoria could be talked into returning - even though she was never officially approached (which is jaw droppingly stupid for any showrunner). Just another thing that CC got so wrong with the reboot.

 

[Laurie!]

What's it called when one does a CC?

Ummm cancelled?!:byebye:


Sorry, couldn't resist. I had semi high hopes for a female showrunner but even she made the women characters weak.

They built Ann up prior to the show airing, as an independent, horse tamer who was Bobby's equal, only to turn her into a simpering, sobbing puddle of snot and tears. Even Linda had to ask for a beefed up role (again, despite the tale of the three musketeers). When they allowed Linda more lines, the scenes were some of the best...but again, just to be crying all of the time.

Cynthia seemed to allow Patrick to crawl too far up her behind and seemed to veer the course in his character's direction all of the time (Bobby saves the day). Which ultimately hurt the show as a next generation tale. I like Patrick and for the most part, liked Bobby on the original but whenever he's given part of the reigns, we end up with crap. I mean, killing Christopher so we could watch Bobby deal with it?!?! There went the next generation.

 

[Pamela_E]

n

Ummm cancelled?!:byebye:


Sorry, couldn't resist. I had semi high hopes for a female showrunner but even she made the women characters weak.

They built Ann up prior to the show airing, as an independent, horse tamer who was Bobby's equal, only to turn her into a simpering, sobbing puddle of snot and tears. Even Linda had to ask for a beefed up role (again, despite the tale of the three musketeers). When they allowed Linda more lines, the scenes were some of the best...but again, just to be crying all of the time.

Cynthia seemed to allow Patrick to crawl too far up her behind and seemed to veer the course in his character's direction all of the time (Bobby saves the day). Which ultimately hurt the show as a next generation tale. I like Patrick and for the most part, liked Bobby on the original but whenever he's given part of the reigns, we end up with crap. I mean, killing Christopher so we could watch Bobby deal with it?!?! There went the next generation.

Sue Ellen would have been a guest character if she had not done that interview with Ultimate Dallas where she spoke out. She was very savvy, not the Linda of the 80's. She knew she had some power under her belt with the mass media pick up.

It was more fun what was happening off screen than on.

I remember when that TNT person came on the forum to defend the show and was shot to pieces.

What an insane time.


I agree about Ann, she started off well and then turned into a complete bore.

 

[Laurie!]

Sue Ellen would have been a guest character if she had not done that interview with Ultimate Dallas where she spoke out. She was very savvy, not the Linda of the 80's. She knew she had some power under her belt with the mass media pick up.

I remember when that TNT person came on the forum to defend the show and was shot to pieces.

I agree about Ann, she started off well and then turned into a complete bore.

Kudos to Linda.

I vaguely remember some dude who seemed like we should be impressed with him, but speaking for myself...honestly, it could have been Larry, Patrick or Linda and I wouldn't have changed my opinion to suck up. As it turns out, we were the ones who for some asinine reason, had to point out the obvious flaws in storyline such as Sue Ellen needing to move to Austin if she became Governor. How sad is that?

Ann was most entertaining when Brenda's screen chemistry with Mitch was highlighted. Like when their characters still had obvious lingering sexual attraction.

 

[Pamela_E]

Kudos to Linda.

I vaguely remember some dude who seemed like we should be impressed with him, but speaking for myself...honestly, it could have been Larry, Patrick or Linda and I wouldn't have changed my opinion to suck up. As it turns out, we were the ones who for some asinine reason, had to point out the obvious flaws in storyline such as Sue Ellen needing to move to Austin if she became Governor. How sad is that?

Ann was most entertaining when Brenda's screen chemistry with Mitch was highlighted. Like when their characters still had obvious lingering sexual attraction.

I liked the idea of Ann but think Bobby would have been more interesting with someone a little more sassy.

I did like Ann's daughter although I can't even remember her name.

 

[Laurie!]

I liked the idea of Ann but think Bobby would have been more interesting with someone a little more sassy.

I did like Ann's daughter although I can't even remember her name.

I grew to despise Bobby on TNT Dallas and as a lifelong fan, that was difficult for me. So frankly, I didn't much care who he was with anymore or what he did for that matter.

I'd have to Google the character name too.

 

[Spooky Owl!]

I liked the idea of Ann but think Bobby would have been more interesting with someone a little more sassy.

Ann was essentially a soccer mom. A smug contemporary archetype that hardly fit in DALLAS, let alone at Southfork.

If the writing had been acceptable, I could have overlooked Ann and her casting.

 

[Pamela_E]

Ratings may have just dipped, but the show lost it's integrity, it lost the viewer's trust and it then lost key cast members -Bobby's return was definitely where it all started going Pete Tong and couldn't turn it around.

I'm all for not revealing spoilers and giving viewers a great mystery to solve, but the suggestion that you use media outlets to report false information in an effort to drive up publicity is very wrong IMO.

I think that Bobby's return being the time the show went down is a misconception.

The show had begun to struggle in the series following Bobby's shooting. The whole vibe had changed. It was Bobby's upcoming death that gave the series some poignancy. But the real hammer on the head was the dream season.

Even my family who had been massive fans switched off, leaving me alone for the first time in front of the TV. I clearly remember my parents watching the episode Wind of Change and saying that finally there was a good episode but it just went down from there.

Once people stop watching it's hard to get them back. Bobby's return got the ratings back up, although perhaps it was short lived.

 

[Frankenstein Underworld]

Cynthia seemed to allow Patrick to crawl too far up her behind and seemed to veer the course in his character's direction all of the time (Bobby saves the day). Which ultimately hurt the show as a next generation tale. I like Patrick and for the most part, liked Bobby on the original but whenever he's given part of the reigns, we end up with crap. I mean, killing Christopher so we could watch Bobby deal with it?!?! There went the next generation.

Killing off Christopher was the definitive proof that Cidre didn't actually care about doing a next generation Dallas. If I'm remembering correctly, his screen time was also reduced in season 3. I wasn't even a big Christopher fan, but he was still a next generation character. Even Patrick finally had to admit that season 3 was problematic because the Ewings became the peripheral characters instead of the main focus of the show. I for one was glad it was cancelled because it was obviously going to continue distancing itself further from the original series.

 

[Frankenstein Underworld]

Victoria's statement had nothing to do with the plot outcome. Her statement came after the plot was filmed. I have no idea what she meant, maybe she was just unhappy with VP at the time so said that.

Interesting. If her goal was to make VP look bad, I think she failed. Instead, she made it sound like she would have toyed with fans's emotions had VP not spoiled the surprise.

It's also interesting how the various Dallas showrunners didn't have a good relationship with VP, including one who never met her!

 

[Kenny Coyote]

Interesting. If her goal was to make VP look bad, I think she failed. Instead, she made it sound like she would have toyed with fans's emotions had VP not spoiled the surprise.

It's also interesting how the various Dallas showrunners didn't have a good relationship with VP, including one who never met her!

I know she has been married twice and divorced twice. I've heard here that despite spending ten years on Dallaa, she doesn't talk to any of her co-stars anymore. I'm starting to get the idea that she must be very difficult to get along with. Could that be why she spends so much time with animals - that it's because she is unable to maintain close human relationships?

 

[Rove]

I know she has been married twice and divorced twice. I've heard here that despite spending ten years on Dallaa, she doesn't talk to any of her co-stars anymore. I'm starting to get the idea that she must be very difficult to get along with. Could that be why she spends so much time with animals - that it's because she is unable to maintain close human relationships?

Gee Kenny. You've just summed up 99.9% of Hollywood. Does Victoria go out of her way to inflict harm on others? No. This is beginning to look like a personal vendetta against Victoria for what was her decision and hers alone.

 

[Kenny Coyote]

Gee Kenny. You've just summed up 99.9% of Hollywood. Does Victoria go out of her way to inflict harm on others? No. This is beginning to look like a personal vendetta against Victoria for what was her decision and hers alone.

I have no personal feeling about her public statement one way or the other. It doesn't affect my life. I think everyone knows what I think of Cynthia Cidre's abortion of a Dallas continuation, so I'm certainly not sticking up for CC. I did state reasons why I think the public statement made VP look bad, that nobody else does that, and for good reason, and therefore I think it was the wrong way to handle it.

For me to have a personal vendetta I'd have to have personal feelings about it in some way.

You on the other hand, reacted quite defensively when I just stated that VP has been divorced twice, has no children, and from what I've read on this forum, has no friendships with former co-stars. Do you have a personal stake in that somehow? I'm quite sure 99.9% of hollywood isn't unmarried with no children.

 

[Rove]

I'm no longing contributing to this thread ​

 

[Pamela_E]

Killing off Christopher was the definitive proof that Cidre didn't actually care about doing a next generation Dallas. If I'm remembering correctly, his screen time was also reduced in season 3. I wasn't even a big Christopher fan, but he was still a next generation character. Even Patrick finally had to admit that season 3 was problematic because the Ewings became the peripheral characters instead of the main focus of the show. I for one was glad it was cancelled because it was obviously going to continue distancing itself further from the original series.

This was always going to be a struggle for SOME original fans who wanted some throwback piece.

They were making a TV show and yes it failed on many levels in terms of story and character but this had no connection to their loyalty to the original.

In fact I think Sue Ellen had some of the best materiel the character had been given since the very early episodes of Dallas, if not better. The dynamic with Linda and Josh was at times electric.

As a Producer you are trying to make a TV show and some characters just don't work regardless if they were original characters or new ones.

Christopher as played by Jesse Metcalfe just didn't cut it. He rated badly with the audience polls so the whole premise for the show was changed. That is to say it was meant to be about the cousins feud, that was dropped and the character sidelined.

It is highly likely that Jr's daughter would have changed from being John Ross's ally to his enemy. So picking the fued up again but between John Ross and his sister.

My only issue with Christopher's end was that it was a knee jerk and implemented in a panic. I would rather have known he was going and see it play out with a build up.

 

[pete lashmar]

One of CC's biggest mistakes was not switching the personalities of the cousins. Making Christopher the J.R of TNT would have led to far more drama and conflict, but she went with the generic formula and Jesse really was mis-cast imo.

Back to VP - I've left many jobs where I've gotten on with my work colleagues but don't talk to them anymore. I'm also divorced and have no children but do have 2 dogs. Does that make me a very difficult person, no....it makes me human.

If there is any ill will with other original cast members I'd put it down to them still being so dependent on Dallas they'd agree to a continuation no matter of it's quality - whereas VP simply doesn't need to or want to.

When cast members start appearing at conventions, charging for their autographs you know they've become feeders...meet and make your fans pay to see you, to have an autograph or photo..? Never agreed with that and the prices are outrageous.