Should all of the Ewings have lived at Southfork in nuDALLAS?

Kenny Coyote

Telly Talk Star
Of course there are always anomalies but I don’t think the guy you know is the norm. Many wealthy families live on compounds and such but to actually occupy the same house and raise children from multiple families would be rare, at least in my experience.

Lincoln didn’t declare war on his own people they succeeded. You’re free to leave the union and free to even take territory, but no one is free to remove a state. This has never been accepted policy in any nation of which I am aware. Succession is rebellion and they lost because they were ignorant of their ability to fight the federal government. Your premise does not fit the facts of history. They took up arms against the federal government and murdered millions of young men in an effort to steal land from this country to create a new nation with it. I will agree it was not about the morality of slavery as much as the premise of power and such from a united nation. The south was economically stupid to hold onto the less economically beneficial institution of slavery for the far for profitable set up of wage slavery. The new money in the north was not about to follow this economic ignorance nor allow it to spread into the west. So, the South thought they could leave. Again, they are welcome to leave, just not take pieces of this nation with them. Sell their land and get out, yes. Open revolution against the constitution of the United States, no. Unless you can find one word in the constitution which addresses the ability of a state to succeed you are just justify insurrection - and are way off topic.

I like your enthusiasm for your idea, but nothing justified Lincoln going to war against his own people. They seceeded. That means they left the country, but that doesn’t require a war. The disagreed about the power the central government should have over the states. The Confederacy was for states’ rights and the North was for the federal government ruling all. Lincoln should have used diplomacy and saved a million lives.

Remember, our country was founded upon rebellion. We didn’t have a legal right to take England’s colonies away, but we did it anyway because we wanted to do it. I’m not sure where you get the idea that it was the South attacking the North. Thy defended themselves against attack, but just look at where the battles were fought. In the South.
 

stevew

Telly Talk Star
I like your enthusiasm for your idea, but nothing justified Lincoln going to war against his own people. They seceeded. That means they left the country, but that doesn’t require a war. The disagreed about the power the central government should have over the states. The Confederacy was for states’ rights and the North was for the federal government ruling all. Lincoln should have used diplomacy and saved a million lives.

Remember, our country was founded upon rebellion. We didn’t have a legal right to take England’s colonies away, but we did it anyway because we wanted to do it. I’m not sure where you get the idea that it was the South attacking the North. Thy defended themselves against attack, but just look at where the battles were fought. In the South.

Succession is the right to go to war against those who declared themselves a new foreign power. Succession is to say you are no longer part of this county, hence not his people and you’re stealing what belongs to America. Sound like every reason to go to war. If we use your idea there’s no longer a reason to have a military - anyone who wants a piece of the us can just come in and take it and declare succession.

You are wrong. Lincoln did not support power over all. He supported the constitution as it was written and the Supreme Court interpreted and to which he swore an oath to uphold. No state has the right to succeed, it’s just not in the constitution. And the supreme law of the land is the constitution - that is in there. You can’t just change the document. There is a process to change it, the Amendment process. And 9 Supreme Court justices have the power to alter previous interpretations. There is no succession clause.

Yes you are correct we were formed by rebellion and England had every right to try and stop us. Not even our founding fathers would argue such a point. But they were not able to put down that rebellion and Lincoln was. The south attacked the us the minute they declared succession - they declared the theft of land. I don’t negotiate with a man who breaks into my house. He gets a bullet right between the eyes so the only story told is mine.

If we’re to believe they can declare they are no longer be part of the government and the land they own is their’s based on state government documents, which is what we say. And that such ownership allows them to remove it from the jurisdiction of the federal government, than all any foreign power has to do is by land and present their deed and say this is no longer American territory. That would be absurd and so is your position.

Your statements are not enthusiastic for your point but justifications for treasonous acts, if we are to assume these people were still use citizens helping those who declared they were not. Or justifications against the assault of an enemy taking US territory. If we assume they were no longer citizens, your post is treasonous by giving giving aid and comfort (justifications) to an enemy (albeit long since passed).

It is NOT a state’s right to succeed. The constitution is clear in joining the states. If it were not then the part where something not being mentioned in the constitution made it a power of the state or the people would apply. But it clearly does not as the power of allegiance is in the constitution including the power to join. I suppose Congress could pass a law for success along the same vein but it did not.

Furthermore the institution the south was attempting to preserve was not only financially stupid it was morally apprehensible. But the constitution allowed it, until it did not.

Frankly you’d have an easier time justifying Mexican re-annexation of Texas than Southern succession.
 

Kenny Coyote

Telly Talk Star
Succession is the right to go to war against those who declared themselves a new foreign power. Succession is to say you are no longer part of this county, hence not his people and you’re stealing what belongs to America. Sound like every reason to go to war. If we use your idea there’s no longer a reason to have a military - anyone who wants a piece of the us can just come in and take it and declare succession.

You are wrong. Lincoln did not support power over all. He supported the constitution as it was written and the Supreme Court interpreted and to which he swore an oath to uphold. No state has the right to succeed, it’s just not in the constitution. And the supreme law of the land is the constitution - that is in there. You can’t just change the document. There is a process to change it, the Amendment process. And 9 Supreme Court justices have the power to alter previous interpretations. There is no succession clause.

Yes you are correct we were formed by rebellion and England had every right to try and stop us. Not even our founding fathers would argue such a point. But they were not able to put down that rebellion and Lincoln was. The south attacked the us the minute they declared succession - they declared the theft of land. I don’t negotiate with a man who breaks into my house. He gets a bullet right between the eyes so the only story told is mine.

If we’re to believe they can declare they are no longer be part of the government and the land they own is their’s based on state government documents, which is what we say. And that such ownership allows them to remove it from the jurisdiction of the federal government, than all any foreign power has to do is by land and present their deed and say this is no longer American territory. That would be absurd and so is your position.

Your statements are not enthusiastic for your point but justifications for treasonous acts, if we are to assume these people were still use citizens helping those who declared they were not. Or justifications against the assault of an enemy taking US territory. If we assume they were no longer citizens, your post is treasonous by giving giving aid and comfort (justifications) to an enemy (albeit long since passed).

It is NOT a state’s right to succeed. The constitution is clear in joining the states. If it were not then the part where something not being mentioned in the constitution made it a power of the state or the people would apply. But it clearly does not as the power of allegiance is in the constitution including the power to join. I suppose Congress could pass a law for success along the same vein but it did not.

Furthermore the institution the south was attempting to preserve was not only financially stupid it was morally apprehensible. But the constitution allowed it, until it did not.

Frankly you’d have an easier time justifying Mexican re-annexation of Texas than Southern succession.

It seems like you think I’m trying to present a case for secession. I’m not. I’m saying Lincoln botched it horribly by using violence instead of diplomacy to get everyone back on the same page. You said they stole the land. The land is still there. It always will be, but Lincoln okayed going to war against our own people. If he’d had gone the diplomatic route the land would also still be there, and the country could have gotten back together without a million people needlessly dying.
 

stevew

Telly Talk Star
It seems like you think I’m trying to present a case for secession. I’m not. I’m saying Lincoln botched it horribly by using violence instead of diplomacy to get everyone back on the same page. You said they stole the land. The land is still there. It always will be, but Lincoln okayed going to war against our own people. If he’d had gone the diplomatic route the land would also still be there, and the country could have gotten back together without a million people needlessly dying.

The case for succession was made by the people who succeeded, the southern state governments and the people they convinced to join their cause and yes the civilians (who are the only possible victim as of your case) who were caught in the middle.

Violence should be a last resort and states rights should trump federal power. For example, President Trump was wrong to threaten to call in uninvited troops to put down any issue within the state, peaceful or otherwise. Nothing in the constitution or the laws passed based on the constitution gives him that right, unless a federal law or court ruling is violated. So maybe if the protestors attacked federal buildings. Otherwise he should keep his mouth shut when it come to threats of turning the military on Americans.

That is NOT what happened for Lincoln - southern state governments succeeded (declared such publicly) and took up arms to defend that succession. That land is still only part of the US because Lincoln went to war against these governments which declared it self a foreign power and the occupation of American territory. Lincoln is a hero who defended the constitution and American security against traitors who instead of joining enemy powers became enemy powers (just as the British clearly saw the revolutionist founding fathers - though accept this county today as sovereign as seen with statues of Washington and Lincoln and other presidents in their Capitol, statues = acceptance of their cause).

There is NO diplomacy with anyone who attacks the US, not when they bomb us at a military base nor give harbor to an organization which stole plans and weaponized them against us nor when state governments declare succession and occupy American soil. No one should ever doubt America’s resolve to kill millions of people to protect itself, not even those who were once fellow Americans. The blunder was the declaration of the southern state governments to succeeded, no longer be part of the United States - to become a foreign enemy.
 

Kenny Coyote

Telly Talk Star
That land is still only part of the US because Lincoln went to war against these governments which declared it self a foreign power and the occupation of American territory

Did they really call themselves a “foreign” power? That would have been ridiculous. They couldn’t possibly have been foreign. Something foreign is something that originates from somewhere else!

There is NO diplomacy with anyone who attacks the US, not when they bomb us at a military base nor give harbor to an organization which stole plans and weaponized them against us nor when state governments declare succession and occupy American soil. No one should ever doubt America’s resolve to kill millions of people to protect itself, not even those who were once fellow Americans.

There was no diplomacy, or no effective diplomacy used. If there had been, it never would have escalated to the point where they would have decided to secede. I’d hope that the president of the country would have the wherewithal to be diplomatic enough to avoid the deaths of million of his own people. Even after the secession Lincoln could have left the door open for negotiation. Just because they seceded didn’t mean they wouldn’t have changed their minds later.

Lincoln got more American soldiers killed than were killed in both world wars, Korea and Vietnam combined. That’s a dubious achievement. It wasn’t self defense because the South wasn’t going to invade the North and couldn’t have even if they had wanted to. It was an exchange of human life for power. It did make the country more powerful, but look at the cost. If you consider human life to be sacred, how could you justify getting all those people killed?
 
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Moderation comment

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This thread is being derailed. Not a single post on this page has anything to do with the Ewings living on Southfork, nor anything Dallas-related.

Please could we bring discussion back to the original thread topic.​
 

Kenny Coyote

Telly Talk Star

Please could we bring discussion back to the original thread topic.​

Since May 1st stevew and I have been the only two people posting here. Doesn’t a discussion have to exist for it to be derailed? Stevew and I were the only two people reviving any discussion in this thread. I’ll gladly comply with your request but I’d just like to ask why would you prefer a thread with no discussion at all to a thread where at least there was enjoyable, thought-provoking discussion place?

Thank you @Mel O'Drama - quite a few threads in the Dallas forum get "taken over" and away from the Original posters intentions for discussion. It takes the fun away .................

Barbara Fan, I was just looking for your post or posts in this thread and didn’t see any. Are you sure that I or anyone else derailed the discussion you were having in this thread? Maybe I accidentally missed your contributions to this thread so I’m asking in case I did. It wasn’t my intention to derail your discussion. I didn’t mean to “take the fun away” as you described it. I’m terminating the discussion I was having, out of respect for the moderator’s request, so it’s all yours now. Have at it.
 

stevew

Telly Talk Star
Did they really call themselves a “foreign” power? That would have been ridiculous. They couldn’t possibly have been foreign. Something foreign is something that originates from somewhere else!



There was no diplomacy, or no effective diplomacy used. If there had been, it never would have escalated to the point where they would have decided to secede. I’d hope that the president of the country would have the wherewithal to be diplomatic enough to avoid the deaths of million of his own people. Even after the secession Lincoln could have left the door open for negotiation. Just because they seceded didn’t mean they wouldn’t have changed their minds later.

Lincoln got more American soldiers killed than were killed in both world wars, Korea and Vietnam combined. That’s a dubious achievement. It wasn’t self defense because the South wasn’t going to invade the North and couldn’t have even if they had wanted to. It was an exchange of human life for power. It did make the country more powerful, but look at the cost. If you consider human life to be sacred, how could you justify getting all those people killed?

Yes the confederacy considered themselves a foreign power with each state sovereign. It printed its own money, had its own governments and a confederate union.

There would be no diplomacy once they succeeded just as we didn’t go into discussion a with Japan after Pearl Harbor. Yes the issues that lead the south to choose to separate were discussed since prior to even creating a nation. It was decades long worth of talk and appeasement of the south. Lincoln was clear he was willing to continue appeasement. The south choose to separate as they were done negotiating and wanted their own nation - which they created.

Lincoln did not get those people killed, the people who relinquished belonging to this county and declared they were taking the southern half of this country did. I don’t blame Roosevelt for getting us into WWII and I don’t blame Lincoln for the Civil War. I blame the aggressors. In Roosevelt’s case they were flat up enemies. In Lincoln’s case they were traitors who left to become enemies. Then they had the audacity to act as if they were the victims and people like you buy it.
 

stevew

Telly Talk Star
Moderation comment

going-off-topic-banner.png


This thread is being derailed. Not a single post on this page has anything to do with the Ewings living on Southfork, nor anything Dallas-related.

Please could we bring discussion back to the original thread topic.​

While I’ll agree this is a tangent it does relate to the bigger picture of the Southern environment. If there’s something more on topic you’d like to cover I’d be more than happy to discuss it.
 

Kenny Coyote

Telly Talk Star
While I’ll agree this is a tangent it does relate to the bigger picture of the Southern environment. If there’s something more on topic you’d like to cover I’d be more than happy to discuss it.

Excellent point. The discussion took that tangent because farming and ranching families tend to be more likely to have more than one generation of adults living in the same home. It’s southern culture and Texas is a southern state.

It’s hard to derail a discussion that doesn’t exist. Somehow I thought any discussion, unless it’s abusive (and I certainly didn’t feel I was being abused), that relates in some way to the topic and that people are enjoying would be perceived as better than no discussion at all.

Just as it’s hard to derail a discussion that doesn’t exist, it’s also hard to participate in a discussion that doesn’t exist. For anyone who thought our discussion was “taking the fun away”, here’s your opportunity to start a fun discussion. The thread is wide open now for any of you to contribute your ideas. Any takers?
 
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This thread is further off-topic than it was when posters were politely requested to bring things back on-topic. Conversations not relating directly to the topic may be continued by PM if you choose.

Posters are requested to remain on topic and to be respectful of decisions taken by the moderation team. There will be no further public discussion of this matter.​
 

tommie

Telly Talk Hero
Maybe Miss Ellie should've put a codicil in her will that who ever lives at Southfork permanently gets to control the rights of the land, leading to everyone moving into the main house and trying various hijinxs to get the others out. After all, Ma Ewing would just be following the footsteps of Pa Ewing's will.
 

Kenny Coyote

Telly Talk Star
Should all the Ewings have lived at Southfork in TNT Dallas? I think it took the fun away when the Ewings didn’t live together at Southfork anymore. I remember hearing people who were barely even watched the show commenting on how the new set-up took the fun away from Dallas. Once the fun is gone, how do you bring it back?

It was like a show that had been one thing then got turned into something else. I guess you could say Dallas got off track. It certainly was not what it had once been. The end result was the executives at the network calling the shots told them they couldn't make any more episodes, not even one more to wrap up the story. They just cancelled it. They didn’t even pay attention to the petition the Dallas fans had created to save the show. As far as the executives were concerned, it was their way or the highway. Unreal. I don’t know how people get like that. A show with so much history and they didn’t even give them one last episode to finish the story? That was just heartless. I have to think that if TNT Dallas had just left the show as what it was meant to be, one happy family living under the same roof, all that would have been avoided and Dallas would still be on the air today.
 
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Kenny Coyote

Telly Talk Star
Maybe Miss Ellie should've put a codicil in her will that who ever lives at Southfork permanently gets to control the rights of the land, leading to everyone moving into the main house and trying various hijinxs to get the others out. After all, Ma Ewing would just be following the footsteps of Pa Ewing's will.

I like that. Miss Ellie could have made it into a contest, to be even more like Jock’s will. Over a three year time period, the marriage that produced the most children during that time would have inherited everything. They should have named the episode to start off the contest “Big Love.” It would have been so appropriate.

Big Love by Fleetwood Mac - from their 1987 Tango in The Night album

Looking out for love
In the night so still
Oh, I'll build you a kingdom
In that house on the hill
Looking out for love
Big, big love
You said that you love me
And that you always will
Oh, you begged me to keep you
In that house on the hill
Looking out for love
Big, big love
I wake up alone with it all
I wake up but only to fall
Looking out for love
Big, big love
Just looking out for love
Big, big love

 

DallasFanForever

Telly Talk Supreme
I honestly don’t think it would’ve mattered if they were all living under the same roof on TNT Dallas. Bad writing is bad writing, and I think the show would’ve met the same fate. In the writers’ defense an entire family of people that large living under the same roof really isn’t practical in today’s world. I don’t even think it was practical back in the times of the original show. But even had they tried it I think the show still meets the same demise. Where they lived wouldn’t change the bad storylines, I uninteresting characters and continuity Issues
 
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