The Fittja, Sweden rape

[tommie]

I guess this can fall under "last night in Sweden"?

Anyway, this horrible rape were made by these guys. I can't believe they weren't convicted because the whole tale is so horrible. The woman was on drugs and then beaten and forced to have sex with these men. But since the jury couldn't decide if she was of clear mind when she had sex with these people they won
t convict and I'm mad as hell! This is horrible.

I feel so mad and need to rant.

https://www.expressen.se/nyheter/brottscentralen/misstankta-for-gruppvaldtakt-forsatta-pa-fri-fot/

 

[Emelee]

It's absolutely sickening how it's always "word against word", which basically always means that if not for dumb luck (witness, camera etc), the rapists go free in trial.

The sole consolation is that everyone the rapists know knows they have been trialed for rape, and pretty much knows that they are guilty.

I hope the newest concent law, combined with the law that everyone involved are as guilty can take care of some cases.

Ps: I would classify this under #metoo

 

[tommie]

It's absolutely sickening how it's always "word against word", which basically always means that if not for dumb luck (witness, camera etc), the rapists go free in trial.

In this case is wasn't though ("word against word"). She was badly beaten. There was evidence at the scene. The perps admitted involvement.

Ps: I would classify this under #metoo

No. That's a tag that was once important but got out of control.

 

[Emelee]

No. That's a tag that was once important but got out of control.

Why do you think that?! I think it brilliantly focuses on a major issue in society, namely that many people with power think they can behave anyway they like. And also how people in dependancy are often too afraid to speak up, afraid of losing (which they most certainly will).

 

[tommie]

Why do you think that?! I think it brilliantly focuses on a major issue in society, namely that many people with power think they can behave anyway they like. And also how people in dependancy are often too afraid to speak up, afraid of losing (which they most certainly will).

Yeah like no. When it starts going from brutal rapes to "someone touched my knees" I can't take it seriously.

 

[Emelee]

Yeah like no. When it starts going from brutal rapes to "someone touched my knees" I can't take it seriously.

Just because there are a few loonies out there doesn't mean the entire cause is ridiculous. It's just a part of the women's rights movement that seemed to have stagnated.

 

[tommie]

Just because there are a few loonies out there doesn't mean the entire cause is ridiculous. It's just a part of the women's rights movement that seemed to have stagnated.

Sadly the loonies have been given a voice.

Also, comparing it to middle class white women problems is exactly the problem here - you have a drug addict (bad), sex worker (mega bad) and someone "ethnic" (horrible) that got raped. Shit, I don't even want to put "raped" as a crime here - she was horrifically beaten, forced to do things against her will, and then spat on.

 

[Emelee]

Loonies always get a voice. Nothing new there. But #metoo has been terrific.
While white middle class women in Sweden have it very good compared to others, we still could do better. And should. White middle class women can still get brutally raped and killed etc. Take the famous cases of Pernilla & Engla, Tova Moberg, Kim Wall, Lotta Rudholm and Lisa Holm...
http://dodadekvinnor.story.aftonbladet.se/chapter/dodade-kvinnor/

And in almost all cases, it's someone the victim knows. And it's the same pattern - someone that thinks they have the right to do anything with another person who is currently in dependency or in their violence.

 

[tommie]

I can't with you bringing up Kim Wall, but I guess I have to.

There's no comparison. None. What this woman experienced is not comparable.

 

[tommie]

And then you make the Engla case -another horrible case but an oddity. You're kidding me right?

 

[tommie]

Also, this is a horrid rape. Yet again she was BEATEN and LEFT FOR DEAD. How hard is this to understand. I'll just stand here and have it as a think piece.

 

[tommie]

Shit, @Emelee if you're a woman you'd understand my concern - it's not okay. I have to put my foot down. Not okay.

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

It's absolutely sickening how it's always "word against word", which basically always means that if not for dumb luck (witness, camera etc), the rapists go free in trial.

The sole consolation is that everyone the rapists know knows they have been trialed for rape, and pretty much knows that they are guilty.

I hope the newest concent law, combined with the law that everyone involved are as guilty can take care of some cases.

Ps: I would classify this under #metoo

Why do you think that?! I think it brilliantly focuses on a major issue in society, namely that many people with power think they can behave anyway they like. And also how people in dependancy are often too afraid to speak up, afraid of losing (which they most certainly will).

Just because there are a few loonies out there doesn't mean the entire cause is ridiculous. It's just a part of the women's rights movement that seemed to have stagnated.

Loonies always get a voice. Nothing new there. But #metoo has been terrific.
While white middle class women in Sweden have it very good compared to others, we still could do better. And should. White middle class women can still get brutally raped and killed etc. Take the famous cases of Pernilla & Engla, Tova Moberg, Kim Wall, Lotta Rudholm and Lisa Holm...
http://dodadekvinnor.story.aftonbladet.se/chapter/dodade-kvinnor/

And in almost all cases, it's someone the victim knows. And it's the same pattern - someone that thinks they have the right to do anything with another person who is currently in dependency or in their violence.

Rose McGowan says the media should stop saying "alleged" and TeenVogue says a few innocent men being destroyed is just the acceptable price of overthrowing the patriarchy.

A "few loonies"? And just what exactly has "stagnated"?

 

[Emelee]

My schedule is way too busy to take yet another disussion on this topic. I won't fight for what I believe in when it won't change any little thing. You get upset for some things, I get upset for other things. And no, you cannot compare one person's experience with another person's experience.

I continue to say that even though it's absoltely despicable that rapists go free, we do live in a society where we absolutely cannot take the law into our own hands. In this case, the prosecutor just could not PROVE what they claimed happened. The victim's story could not be verified. And most likely, it was a horrible police investigation behind it all. So even though we all know what happened, if it cannot be proven in a court of law, it's word against word. And in many cases, word against word means rape victims gets to suffer twice. It's the same for me as a teacher. I can KNOW that a student is excellent, but if said student cannot prove their skills when it counts, I cannot give that student a high grade. A student can have written the most perfect essay a student has ever written, but if the essay doesn't answer the question in the instructions, then the student gets an F.

While very very tempting, you cannot act on what you know (or believe that you know) or how you feel. And that is why the court's decision does not upset me. It's not their fault. They were just not presented with good enough evidence. And I bet that you can blame bad police work for that, as in most strange cases, it's bad police work behind. Just as GW.

Edit:
Read this https://www.aftonbladet.se/debatt/a/P3RMoz/darfor-domdes-inte-mannen-for-valdtakt

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

And then there are all the false rape allegations that go on. Injustice happens.

 

[Emelee]

And then there are all the false rape allegations that go on. Injustice happens.

I highly doubt many of the rape allegations that come in every day in the world are false. I think a large majority are cases of actual rape.

Most rape charges will not lead anywhere because they are so hard to prove. Probably the easiest crime to get away with. Cause no one will get convicted if there is any little doubt.

But maybe that is a good thing? I know I'd rather see a criminal go free than an innocent person be sent to jail.

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

I highly doubt many of the rape allegations that come in every day in the world are false. I think a large majority are cases of actual rape.

But what you doubt and what you think has little bearing on it.

But maybe that is a good thing? I know I'd rather see a criminal go free than an innocent person be sent to jail.

That sentiment has little meaning when you're convinced women almost never lie. Talk to any big city police department about the issue.

 

[Emelee]

But what you doubt and what you think has little bearing on it.


That sentiment has little meaning when you're convinced women almost never lie. Talk to any big city police department about the issue.

Your attitude that so many women lie about rape feels insulting. Normal people don't lie about such things. I'd much rather lie about NOT getting raped than lie about getting raped. The shame of admitting to being raped or violated is not something to take lightly on.

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

Your attitude that so many women lie about rape feels insulting. Normal people don't lie about such things. I'd much rather lie about NOT getting raped than lie about getting raped. The shame of admitting to being raped or violated is not something to take lightly on.

Then you should feel "insulted." Stop being so disingenuous in your virtue signaling. Lots of "normal" women lie (as do men) and you very well know it.

And the "shame" of being raped doesn't feel so shameful when she's making it up.

False allegations are power. It's as simple as that. And that's gone on forever and always will.

 

[Emelee]

Lying comes in many different variations. Lying about being raped is so far from a lie about your age or well, pretty much all other things. All people lie, but not all tell enormous and malicious lies.

I hope you don't think a majority of rape accusations are made up!