TNT revived Dallas for a 2012–14 series. Would you revisit it again?

[the-lost-son]

In essence, every soap character is capable of doing everything, including being likeable or unlikeable. It's not that Bobby was always 100% perfect in old Dallas, but the dilemmas and choices they have to make is what makes it so captivating.

Agreed.

Cliff Barnes, Nicholas Trevino and mother & son Ryland were the wicked villains that we could love to loathe,

It was impossible for me to understand these characters because their motivations remained a mystery to me.
Why was Cliff willing to sacrifice his only daughter to blame the Ewings? He was on friendly terms with SueEllen &Bobby a few episodes earlier?
All the horrible things JR did, in his mind he did it for his daddy, then John Ross and Ewing Oil.
What was Harris Ryland‘s motivation? Mama? Emma? Hate for Ann? Love for Ann? I have no idea.
His actions seemed out of the blue, one-dimensional. Nicolas Trevino remained a cartoonish villain for me and the twists (like killing Elena‘s brother) did not shock me as his motivations were never made clear.

Classic Dallas had a character of Matt Cantrell who was irritating for the same reasons.

If motivations are clear, then the rest is really no rocket science.

I‘m thinking of the Underwoods in „House of cards“. There were many unexpected actions, turns, events. But they all made sense because it was clear what was driving them.

 

[Werewillie Oleson]

All the horrible things JR did, in his mind he did it for his daddy, then John Ross and Ewing Oil.

I think it's debatable. It sounds too much like an excuse to me.
What was it that made JR tick? They were still figuring that out after he had died.

What was Harris Ryland‘s motivation? Mama? Emma? Hate for Ann? Love for Ann? I have no idea.

I'm not 100% certain but I believe he hated Ann for destroying their marriage. And mother Ryland was very keen to support his idea that Ann "made him do" these things because she never wanted another woman in Harris' life to begin with.

Nicolas Trevino remained a cartoonish villain for me and the twists (like killing Elena‘s brother) did not shock me as his motivations were never made clear.

He had obligations to the cartel, who just happened to get involved with the Ewings. He didn't want to kill Drew, but Drew's intentions to expose everything threatened his operation. From Nicolas' point of view he was forced to kill him,
They were practically raised as brothers and this how the story brought them together again. I thought it was very shocking!

 

[Rove]

And mother Ryland was very keen to support his idea that Ann "made him do" these things because she never wanted another woman in Harris' life to begin with.

There was only enough Mama Ryland breast milk to go around.

 

[Rove]

TNT's mistake was in never fully embracing John Ross and Christopher as the focus

Yet this was the premise for TNT Dallas. It was about that next generation and exploring the characters of John Ross and Christopher. What Cynthia failed to appreciate was the immense affection viewers had for JR, Bobby and Sue Ellen. Most of us wished to see what that bastard had been up to all these years. Were JR and Bobby still residing on Southfork? How did Sue Ellen fit into the scheme of things? How did John Ross, Christopher and to a lesser extent Lucas turn out?

I think what should have driven the series from the outset was a solid story pitting the Ewing's against the world or each other. This is what made Lorimar Dallas so captivating. The action was centered around Ewing Oil and Southfork.

Instead Cynthia decided to retcon characters into Lorimar Dallas. While new viewers couldn't care less it upset us old timers. I still bet the majority of those 8 million plus viewers in the United States tuning in to TNT Dallas were the same people that didn't return the following week.

I also liked David Jacobs idea of flipping the characters of John Ross and Christopher. I suspect most would have expected John Ross to be a mini version of JR and Christopher a clone of Bobby. How boring. By having John Ross and Christopher doing the opposite would have made for better viewing in watching the dynamics between fathers and sons.

 

[DallasFanForever]

Making TNT Christopher the bad one over John Ross really makes perfect sense if you think about it. Granted Kristin didn’t raise him, Bobby did, but that aside he had scheming in his blood. I think it’s a natural fit. I’m not sure if a lot of people watching TNT Dallas knew who Kristin really was but apparently the writers did cause she was mentioned, so they had to be aware of her character’s traits and history of conniving.

 

[Werewillie Oleson]

TNT's mistake was in never fully embracing John Ross and Christopher as the focus. Definitely by season 3, once Larry died, it was time for the younger cast to step up.

It was an ensemble cast and that usually works very well for a soap. It also worked for Jock and Miss Ellie and Bobby and JR in old Dallas.
But even so, another Dallas fan is going to say

What Cynthia failed to appreciate was the immense affection viewers had for JR, Bobby and Sue Ellen

So, what was she supposed to do?

Making TNT Christopher the bad one over John Ross really makes perfect sense if you think about it

But Josh Henderson played it so well Sure, they could have switched roles but somehow that doesn't make sense to me.
The way it was done created some great interaction between John Ross and his parents. His flawed nature that aggravated his mother - with very soapy consequences - and the way JR tried to lure him to the dark side - also with very soapy consequences - was very entertaining to watch.

Using Christopher's jealousy for not being a true blood Ewing as an ongoing reason for his villainy would get old pretty fast.
And since both JR and Sue Ellen were still there they could actually do something with John Ross' issues, and show it us. And I think that's more interesting than a reason or motive.

 

[tommie]

Some people don't get it. But that's fine, because some day they will.

And by the way. maybe you should've watched Empire when it aired... bitch.

 

[tommie]

Willeeeeee

 

[Werewillie Oleson]

Yes?

 

[tommie]

Yes?

Just checking.

 

[tommie]

Yes?

 

[Rove]

So, what was she supposed to do?

Use the immense talents of Larry Hagman and show the public JR was still at his wicked best. Age had not wearied him.

 

[Karin]

I think a problem with Dallas TNT was that it came back too late. The show was announced in 2009 but then they wasted a couple of years in development. Years that they didn't have. The audience still wanted to see JR Ewing. But by the time the show finally premiered in 2012 Larry was already sick with cancer and died a few months later.

I think David Jacobs' idea about John Ross and Christopher was the right one since by making John Ross the good guy and Christopher the bad guy you would set up a character dynamic that would clash with their parents and lead to character driven drama.

I think Dallas TNT was often too plot driven. There were too many plot twists and last minute changes just done for shock value. But it fell flat and failed you engage the audience as you stopped caring about the characters.

Imagine how good Dallas TNT could have been if it had started with a wedding. But instead of Christopher marrying Rebecca it would have been John Ross marrying Pamela Rebecca Barnes. JR's son marrying Clif's daughter. It is basically the same premise as the original show and yes it would have worked.

I wouldn't make them elope though but I would have had that big Southfork wedding with JR and Sue Ellen, Cliff and Afton all in attendance and not liking it. There you go you've got fireworks already there!

No threesomes, no sex with dog suits, no mama likes the cocaine or John Ross cheating on Pamela Rebecca. I think that was the main problem with Dallas TNT. It showed us a lot of crap that most of the audience didn't want to watch.

Yes it had moments of brilliance but those moments were far and few in between and sometimes got lost in the rubbish. I think that is what makes me the most sad when I think of Dallas TNT. All that wasted potential just thrown away.

 

[stevew]

With thanks to @Karin Schill in guiding me to a recent interview with Patrick Duffy the following has me intrigued when Patrick is asked if he would revisit Bobby again.

"I put Bobby Ewing behind me twice already and it didn’t work out. So, I’m never one to say, ‘never again.” If it were that brilliant next step in the sequence of the story of those characters, I would be willing to do it. I think it would have to lose a bit of its history in terms of the way that the show was done."

Patrick talks about, "...it would have to lose a bit of its history in the terms of the way that the show was done." Is Patrick talking about Lorimar Dallas or TNT Dallas?

To me it feels like he is discussing the latter and if that's the case I agree with him.

I don't know but I agree - it has to shed some history (or at least do a better job of explaining it) and get back to Dallas as it was prior to the Dream Season, in my opinion, in it's quality of family and business story lines. But, I also think part of that shred is to tie up some of those stories.

Within the first evening (maybe 2-3 hour pilot):

1. Reveal Bobby has moved to California with Pam, who turned out to be a live but won't return to Texas with him, so he lives happily every after with Gary running West Fork. Story ending on a happily every after note.

2. Sue Ellen is sober, happily living a life between Europe and Texas and doing all sorts of social (DoA) and charity (her foundation) work, a happy grandmother who receives flowers from JR on her birthday and both anniversaries every year. She gets to live happily ever after know JR loved her and being a grandmother showing up now and again. Story ending on a happily every after note.

3. JR hands John Ross everything he promised via his master plan: Rylan stays in prison and John Ross gets his black box (along with Jock's red files) and Ryland Transport; John Ross gets West Star, taking it private and including Ewing Oil; John Ross takes control of Ewing Global (the Wentworth assets, Barnes assets, Ewing Alternative and Southfork's Oil) - all combined into Ewing Industries. Story ending on a happily ever after note - JR kept his promise and his Master Plan ended his life on a high of great success.

Then:

4. Chris must turn out to have survived the explosion and can include a long recovery all the years between 2014 and when the show returns.

5. I'd like to see more of Lucy as a regular living at South Fork (maybe buy Bobby out)

6. I'd also like to see some kids at South Fork, especially John Ross Ewing IV, maybe a kid we didn't know about that John Ross had when he was 18 (so he's a young adult now).

and

7. the house has to be put back to the lay out we know.

If they did that, wrapping up story lines that need happy ever after endings and focusing on the 3 children of the 3 children, John Ross, Lucy and Christopher - I'd be very much interested and I believe that it could be brilliant.

Picture it:

Lucy like Angela Channing
John Ross Ewing IV like Lance Cumson
John Ross like Richard Channing
Christopher Ewing like Chase Giobertti

A highly dysfunctional family fighting over land and business. I'd give it a try.

 

[stevew]

Only he could clarify exactly what he met. Me, I'm thinking of something we've discussed here before, which is that if there is a second revival, it would need to essentially be presented as a new series. The target audience needs to be new viewers, not trying to recapture old ones, Larry's dead, and Patrick and Linda are even older now, so we can't hope nostalgia will draw in enough viewers. Shows like Succession and Billions is the model of what I imagine a new Dallas would need to be to work.

I agree - a good model to work with on how the new family / business drama's operate.

 

[stevew]

That's a tough one. TNT Dallas tried to target a new audience but instead faced fierce questioning from the "old ones" asking where was JR and Sue Ellen. Much has been said on this forum when it came to promoting TNT Dallas the media only had an interest in Larry, Patrick and Linda.

Of course any continuation has to move with the times but with its 43 year history I don't wish to see legacy characters dumped entirely. A good writer could easily weave Bobby and Sue Ellen into any continuation without both of them appearing in every scene but it's those two characters which can lay the foundation.

Still I'm curious what Patrick was referring to in losing a bit of its history. Could he have been referring to the Ramos family? The Mexican connection? The death of Christopher? The sudden appearance of JR's long lost daughter?

I've not watched Succession or Billions so I have nothing to reference. Perhaps if they find their way onto Netflix I'll watch to appreciate your recommendation.

Though, BUT if they actually answer those questions in a way that their stories are resolved and fans are happy, I think they can move on.

 

[stevew]

Use the immense talents of Larry Hagman and show the public JR was still at his wicked best. Age had not wearied him.

Agreed. He loved his brother, but that only went so far. He loved Sue Ellen too, but that was complicated as all can be. His great love was his daddy, their name shake, I would imagine a John Ross IV. All the rest (including his momma in the day), fasten your seatbelt. It's gonna be a bumpy ride. JR has a lot to do in his old age to wrap up his life - and yes that's exactly what they could have and should have done.

Being Larry Hagman was ill, they needed to make it more story around such a character than actual acting, but they could have done it because even ill that man sent chills up my spine. And when dead his Masterpiece should have done the same thing - like Jock's death - the tragedy that keeps on giving.

Not a difficult concept for a talented show running, IF that show runner really appreciated Dallas and the character of JR at their height.

 

[stevew]

I think a problem with Dallas TNT was that it came back too late. The show was announced in 2009 but then they wasted a couple of years in development. Years that they didn't have. The audience still wanted to see JR Ewing. But by the time the show finally premiered in 2012 Larry was already sick with cancer and died a few months later.

I think David Jacobs' idea about John Ross and Christopher was the right one since by making John Ross the good guy and Christopher the bad guy you would set up a character dynamic that would clash with their parents and lead to character driven drama.

I think Dallas TNT was often too plot driven. There were too many plot twists and last minute changes just done for shock value. But it fell flat and failed you engage the audience as you stopped caring about the characters.

Imagine how good Dallas TNT could have been if it had started with a wedding. But instead of Christopher marrying Rebecca it would have been John Ross marrying Pamela Rebecca Barnes. JR's son marrying Clif's daughter. It is basically the same premise as the original show and yes it would have worked.

I wouldn't make them elope though but I would have had that big Southfork wedding with JR and Sue Ellen, Cliff and Afton all in attendance and not liking it. There you go you've got fireworks already there!

No threesomes, no sex with dog suits, no mama likes the cocaine or John Ross cheating on Pamela Rebecca. I think that was the main problem with Dallas TNT. It showed us a lot of crap that most of the audience didn't want to watch.

Yes it had moments of brilliance but those moments were far and few in between and sometimes got lost in the rubbish. I think that is what makes me the most sad when I think of Dallas TNT. All that wasted potential just thrown away.

100% agree. Bobby grooming John Ross to take over the ranch because he loves it and Christopher does not, much like Jock. There needed to be a Ewing Oil or Ewing Industries with big bad JR running it from a distance hoping John Ross takes over but left with Christopher willing to do what ever it takes to get what he wants, which includes taking over everything Cliff Barnes stole from his mother (and Katherine). Pamela and Christopher close cousins, especially as he needs her help to control Cliff. Sue Ellen and Cliff thrilled to see the two marry. JR and Afton furious. Oh and Christopher with Elena Anderson, the granddaughter of Punk and Mavis, the poor girl actually in love with Christopher. The big fight at the wedding, Bobby finds out that Christopher has set up a test well on South Fork and on top of it he's contesting the trust so that JR and Lucy (with Gary's vote and bringing her into the story) can approve massive drilling. John Ross pushing Christopher into the pool.

 

[bspooky9]

TNT Dallas bore no resemblance to a show i loved with all my heart and it sucked big time. Even people i loved 1st time round were very annoying in it and the acting was sub standard - its a very bad memory!

I don't think it was so much the acting as the writing-- the classic O-R CBS Lorimar (L-T, Lorimar Television) Dallas we remember had some world-class writing, some of the best in television; no wonder it was a classic.

TNT, however, had it seeming like the writers probably just didn't care about the rich legacy of the CBS series.

 

[stevew]

I don't think it was so much the acting as the writing-- the classic O-R CBS Lorimar (L-T, Lorimar Television) Dallas we remember had some world-class writing, some of the best in television; no wonder it was a classic.

TNT, however, had it seeming like the writers probably just didn't care about the rich legacy of the CBS series.

I agree, they didn't care and didn't want to go there. They seemed to have their own ideas. Some were good to me but they also seemed to not get the basic idea of family and business that was the whole reason for Dallas. The Ewing's weren't much of a family to write about and the business writing wasn't much in my opinion. It was more an attempt at a Cinderella story where Prince Charming didn't come into play. Maybe a fine story but not Dallas.