Looking Back At It, Miss Ellie Was Very Selfish.

[Billy Wall]

I'm not gonna get too much into her "marrying Jock to save her families ranch", but to say to Jock "Bobby will stay if you don't do anything to drive him off. If he leaves, I'll never forgive you." Is she kidding? Jock told her right, "what about JR? While Bobby was sowing his Oates, JR was in the fields." Sue Ellen was getting to be unbearable after her and JR got back together after he recovered from being shot, but maybe she had a point when she told Miss Ellie that she was taking Bobby's side over JR.

Jock was no saint, heck, he cheated on her, but during the course of Dallas, Miss Ellie could be totally unfair to Jock.

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

Well, Jock only cheated on Miss Ellie once -- during war no less. It's true she married Jock to save the ranch, but a lot of women (maybe most?) marry men for the resources or potential resources. Some feel Jock loved Ellie more than she did him, but that's most hetero relationships; I'm not sure Jock deserved better, the reprobate.

BBG joked that she'd had a hard time working up tears over the idea that her 30-year-old son was moving out of the house, but Miss Ellie's trauma over how Gary was treated was still raw.

Yes, JR had enlarged the family fortune, but his behavior was probably hard to ignore.

But it's an old argument: should JR have been treated better? It's hard to believe he should've been, but naturally he felt the answer was "yes." Sue Ellen's opinions fluctuated based on how well she was getting along with JR at any given moment. And of all the Southfork ladies, only Donna -- already rich by her first marriage -- married (to Ray) for the money.

If Ellie was occasionally unfair to Jock, it's hard to care all that much.

 

[Taylor Bennett Jr.]

Miss Ellie had the sense of entitlement that came with growing up as heiress of a prominent ranch (Southfork was supposed to be a *big deal*, especially in her youth — which they didn’t do a great job of getting across a lot of the time, when it seemed more like Ray and a pickup truck and a handful of cows than Kevin Costner’s Yellowstone) who went on to marry an enormously wealthy and powerful oil baron, who was just coming into his period of success.

She had the breeding and class, and a fairly palpable sense of superiority at times, and Jock had the money and power and intimidating nature. Even Sam Culver seemed to defer to her in status, and it didn’t seem like wholly a political act or a southern gentleman thing.

It made all the sense in the world that she’d call up the head of transportation of the state of Texas and order him to put all his resources on finding her sons’ plane, or that she’d be shocked that Harv Smithfield wouldn’t break Jock’s will on her command.

 

[Laurie Marr]

BBG could frequently summon up that sense of entitlement Ellie had when she was cornered. She married beneath her and oftentimes you’d get a glimpse of that.

 

[Taylor Bennett Jr.]

BBG could frequently summon up that sense of entitlement Ellie had when she was cornered. She married beneath her and oftentimes you’d get a glimpse of that.

I feel that’s a key to how she somehow made the “Texas Matriarch with a non-working-class East Coast accent” juxtaposition work. She sounded like someone who’d gone away to prep school, or maybe had a stint at an upscale East Coast college, and ironed all the twang out of her speech in the process.

 

[Bobby Southworth]

This isn't really pertaining to the overall point at hand, well it is, and it isn't. Was Miss Ellie being unfair to J.R. and Jock, after J.R. was shot, and the Bobster was on his power kick and high horse? Perhaps, I mean, my first inclination was to say, hell yeah, but then I thought about how J.R. had mortgaged Southfork the season before.. All the stuff Ellie didn't even know about, pertaining to the Red file, and section 40. J.R. was kind of, just briefly, reaping what he had sowed here, in my opinion.

Now, was she pushing for Bobby to stay on as president because of J.R's shady dealings..most likely, these weren't the things on her mind. She didn't want to lose another son. However, we also can't just ignore the fact that J.R. did something that impacted Miss Ellie so much, pertaining to her home.

That said, I do think, given all the work J.R. put into Ewing Oil, under Jock as an understudy, then by his side, then on his own, Miss Ellie was kinda being selfish,here. I get the not wanting to lose another son angle, but..J.R. was her son, too.

I don't know..this whole thing kinda has me torn. For a woman that didn't want anyone to say boo to Jock after his heart surgery, she certainly put him through the wringer here. Laugh. This is tough too, though because you figure..she has since found out about an unknown first wife, and is in the process of finding out that Ray is the product of an affair she did know about..I dunno. At the end of the day, while she was putting Jock through hell here, maybe the scale balances out more than what it seems.

 

[CeeCee72]

Jock and Ellie were both incredibly selfish and neither of them had a fair bone in their body. They treated their children and grandchildren like chess pieces to me moved around at their whim. They lied and kept secrets from each other. They made unreasonable demands of each other. I never got the sense it was a happy marriage or a happy household until Jock died and Ellie tried to deify him.

 

[Billy Wall]

I'll also like to point out, it's VERY hard to defend JR and I'm not, I'm mainly talking how she treated Jock on occasion. Miss Ellie practically threatening Jock that if Bobby leaves, she'll never forgive him? Like...WHAT?!?!

 

[Mustard]

I'll also like to point out, it's VERY hard to defend JR and I'm not, I'm mainly talking how she treated Jock on occasion. Miss Ellie practically threatening Jock that if Bobby leaves, she'll never forgive him? Like...WHAT?!?!

The whole Gary stuff obviously caused a big divide between them. When Ellie was elated that Gary was "coming home" in the Reunion episodes, she told Jock "I don't want anything to go wrong. Don't you go putting up walls, he doesn't need that" in a very serious tone, and Jock said "Who the hell do you think I am? Our son is coming home and I barely know him. I'm not thinking of putting up walls, I'm thinking of tearing them down".

 

[Taylor Bennett Jr.]

I'll also like to point out, it's VERY hard to defend JR and I'm not, I'm mainly talking how she treated Jock on occasion. Miss Ellie practically threatening Jock that if Bobby leaves, she'll never forgive him? Like...WHAT?!?!

but then… like a year or two later when she’s moving to push JR out as president and JR (rather laughably, when you consider who was in a habit of courting disaster every 2 years or so) said “we‘ll lose Ewing Oil if you put Bobby in charge”.. instead of pointing out that Bobby is perfectly capable, she’s simply, “well, that’s a chance we may have to take”.. and then, I can’t remember, did she end up keeping JR in power anyway? She utterly hung Bobby out to dry - just horrible!

People complain about Bobby’s sanctimoniousness, but man did he have to put up with some ridiculous nonsense from every single family member around him. He should have gotten the hell out of there about a half-season into the series, if not before!

 

[Billy Wall]

but then… like a year or two later when she’s moving to push JR out as president and JR (rather laughably, when you consider who was in a habit of courting disaster every 2 years or so) said “we‘ll lose Ewing Oil if you put Bobby in charge”.. instead of pointing out that Bobby is perfectly capable, she’s simply, “well, that’s a chance we may have to take”.. and then, I can’t remember, did she end up keeping JR in power anyway? She utterly hung Bobby out to dry - just horrible!

People complain about Bobby’s sanctimoniousness, but man did he have to put up with some ridiculous nonsense from every single family member around him. He should have gotten the hell out of there about a half-season into the series, if not before!

I remember her hanging Ray and Lucy out to dry when she called that vote to determine if JR should stay on as president and she ended up voting in his favor. And you're absolutely right about Bobby. Both JR AND Jock literally sabotaged him as president.

 

[CeeCee72]

I remember her hanging Ray and Lucy out to dry when she called that vote to determine if JR should stay on as president and she ended up voting in his favor. And you're absolutely right about Bobby. Both JR AND Jock literally sabotaged him as president.

She handled it terribly, but I always kinda felt that whole meeting was supposed to be a serious warning to JR. But yeah, she completely disregarded Lucy, Ray, and especially Bobby.

 

[Chris2]

I thought the Ellie of the early seasons (“You don’t keep Ellie Ewing waiting”, according to Sue Ellen) was far more interesting than the grandmotherly, more emotionally fragile person she became later on. The Jock/Ellie marriage was fascinating because of the power dynamic between the two of them. And I agree with many of the points above - I wish they had leaned into Ellie’s ranching heritage more, and her entitlement, and how she married beneath her.

After Jock was gone, they lost anyone who might stand up to her. They needed that - perhaps it could have been a new love interest who was better developed than Clayton, or perhaps a new daughter-in-law. Wouldn’t it have been fun if JR had an ambitious second wife who went toe-to-toe with her?

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

I thought the Ellie of the early seasons (“You don’t keep Ellie Ewing waiting”, according to Sue Ellen) was far more interesting than the grandmotherly, more emotionally fragile person she became later on. The Jock/Ellie marriage was fascinating because of the power dynamic between the two of them. And I agree with many of the points above - I wish they had leaned into Ellie’s ranching heritage more, and her entitlement, and how she married beneath her.

After Jock was gone, they lost anyone who might stand up to her. They needed that - perhaps it could have been a new love interest who was better developed than Clayton, or perhaps a new daughter-in-law. Wouldn’t it have been fun if JR had an ambitious second wife who went toe-to-toe with her?

The Ewings of the very early days were what David Jacobs had conceived: white trash with money, corruption in a Texas ranch house. All of the Ewings, even Miss "I don't care if it's fair!" Ellie, were kind of creeps. But in a very series television sort of way, most of the lead characters were quickly redeemed and only naughty J.R. and his blustering play-buddy, Cliff, retained their original flaws. (In fact, Cliff got worse, but only in a cartoonish way).

Not that I'm complaining. But that was more realistic for this kind of uber-rich, powerful family. Not the later Ewings, softened and decent-ified as per the bourgeois expectations of the middleclass audience of the era, where most of the characters shifted into morally upstanding citizens aghast at the machinations of the eldest brother.

As Larry said, if DALLAS showed what really went on in the oil business, "they'd blow up CBS!"

What was always so funny is how Gary and the denizens of KNOTS LANDING, completely rub by David Jacobs, continued to talk about the Texas wing of the Ewings as if they were the vilest corporate clan in the western hemisphere.

Of all the key characters, Miss Ellie remains the one most-compromised and least realized of them all, and I view that as emblematic of what was wrong behind (and in front) of the camera during the last deleterious half of the original series. Especially for the women: Pam grew as a character, Sue Ellen gradually crawled out of the bottle and went into business, Lucy started dressing in a way that no longer looked like she lived at Sow Pork, but Miss Ellie just deteriorated.

Katzman wanted no ballbusters residing at the ranch. So there was nothing scruffy Miss Ellie was permitted to do if she still lived there, eventually leaving the Lone Star State forever while she sailed around the Mediterranean (however improbable as that seemed). The only remaining original female cast member needed to be beefed up in the closing years, and instead was further trivialized and pushed out.

If the writers devalue Miss Ellie, the show is lost. Same with Krystle. And both programs soon had zero interest in either character. (At least the producers of DYNASTY admitted they had no idea what to do with Krystle).