Watching The Colbys for the First Time

[Werewillie Oleson]

It feels like we’ve skipped several episodes’ worth of story here. I can understand Miles’ impetuous decision to marry, especially following Sable’s conniving, but what changed Channing's motivation and behavior? As if to explain, Channing reveals that Lucas tried to share her bed once, and proclaims that Miles can take care of her – only we didn’t see her get to that point. She just… switched

I thought the whole background story was kinda shoddy and uncle Lucas was redundant as yet another bad guy.
But the Russians were great.

 

[Alexis]

Though was Sable ever really bitter or vindictive in the way Alexis was?

 

[Ked]

Though was Sable ever really bitter or vindictive in the way Alexis was?

Sable had very good reasons. Alexis was just being a b*tch.

 

[JROG]

But the Russians were great.

The little I've seen so far, I've enjoyed!

Though was Sable ever really bitter or vindictive in the way Alexis was?

Bitter, certainly. As for vindictive, she mostly has allowed herself to be talked into it. Left to her own devices, she usually cooperates or tries to win Jason back.

 

[Werewillie Oleson]

Characters are usually not defined by just one storyline. Sable had good reasons to be pissed off about Jason & Frankie.
But she also tried to get her nephew evicted from Colby World, not to mention all the things she did to make sure that he wouldn't get Constance's shares of Colby Enterprises. She was a greedy schemer, I mean, that was a part of her character.
Alexis had her reasons to hate Blake, but not Krystle - and certainly not that much. I think it was the only soap feud that was based on pure villainy.
I can even understand the Ewing-Barnes feud, and Angela Channing's motives were similar to Sable's.
Alexis didn't need a motive.

 

[Alexis]

Alexis had her reasons to hate Blake, but not Krystle - and certainly not that much. I think it was the only soap feud that was based on pure villainy.

Oh no I don't agree with this at all. I can totally see why Alexis would hate Krystle. Krystle had assumed Alexis' life. She was married to Blake her husband, she was living in her house, she was living with her children, she was having the life that Alexis was supposed to have. It doesn't matter if that is illogical to you, or me, or anyone. To Alexis it's very clear. And she hates her so much more because she is the total opposite to herself. It's a total shunning of everything that Alexis is! Everything about her. From her angelic soulful nature to her perfect all American good looks and blonde hair which Alexis sees as insipid and plain, pretty but dim. To her natural regal composure and control which Alexis cant understand and so constantly tries to berate her to get a rise out of her.

I have always understood exactly why Alexis hates Krystle.

 

[Werewillie Oleson]

Yes, well, I think that's what I meant. The motives of the other villains were grounded in something more realistic i.e. they actually stood to lose something (even if it wasn't rightfully theirs). To Sable, Jeff was a threat to the Colby fortune she had "reserved" for polo-boy Miles. JR and Angela believed they were entitled to absolute control over the family business, without interference of other family members.
Krystle didn't take anything from Alexis, she was not a threat, not realistically.

 

[Alexis]

Krystle didn't take anything from Alexis, she was not a threat, not realistically

Yea.. Alexis was nuts. That's why we love her.

 

[Ked]

Yea.. Alexis was nuts. That's why we love her.

Exactly.

 

[Spooky Owl!]

Yes, Sable seemed both higher class and more intelligent than Alexis -- Alexis was more the narcissistic poseur, while Sable was the more crafty and clever of the two. (Part of that was the writing while, frankly, part of that came from the casting). And part of that sense of superior class was Sable's selfish villainy being motivated by a more-or-less sincere concern for the welfare of her children, while Alexis barely even had the pretense of that (at least until she returned to Denver and could use her now grown children as a weapon against her ex-husband).

In that way, Sable had a bit more in common with Abby: they were shapeshifting spiders and full of guile. Alexis felt always like a mere usurper, a scattershot and histrionic opportunist whose methods -- eventually -- kind of worked almost in spite of herself.

In fact, I've always wished Alexis had been a bit more like Sable and Abby (and I get the impression Joan did too) because while the whore-made-good quality was part of Alexis' appeal -- that of the Mysterious Slut -- I would like to have seen at least some of her schemes result from a masterful sense of manipulation instead of simple good luck where her lazy tantrums just somehow paid off (a result of much lazier writing than COLBYS or KNOTS ever displayed).

And, yes, I think Alexis' ongoing enmity towards Krystle was based not just on Krystle being the newer, younger wife who now owned Alexis' ex-husband and mansion, but also was the result of Krystle's unnerving characteristic of demonstrating more genuine class (despite a childhood of poverty) than Alexis herself could ever quite muster (despite a childhood next door to privilege).

Alexis wasn't simply jealous of Krystle having Blake, she was just of Krystle being Krystle.

Alexis was wily enough to "get" the concept of class, even if she could never get it for herself as class wasn't the type of possession one achieved through the acquisitiveness Alexis understood. So she knew enough about it to know she didn't have it, which only fueled her efforts at overcompensation by draping herself in so much sapphire and sarcasm that it kind of mesmerizing.

So, yeah, the less-is-more standard of Krystle must have indeed driven Alexis up the wall.

And that's why Alexis symbolically shooting Krystle off her high horse so early in Season 2 was so genuinely tragic -- much more so than the series' general forgetfulness of the crime -- because the only way Alexis could kill Krystle's qualities was by killing Krystle herself.

That's another reason I was so grateful for Season 9: it explained why Krystle had changed, why the original Krystle was lost to us so early (even if that was actually due to hapless writer-producer choices only a couple of years into the program) so she could exit with some retroactive dignity just as Alexis' strategic superior, Sable Colby, blew into town.

It made the whole thing seem a bit more biblical, if only at the eleventh hour.

 

[Werewillie Oleson]

I would like to have seen at least some of her schemes result from a masterful sense of manipulation instead of simple good luck where her lazy tantrums just somehow paid off

Hmm, I wish the writing had been a little more clever, but I liked the way Alexis was, her wicked ways mostly driven by emotion. If she wanted to fight, there was going to be a fight.

Alexis was wily enough to "get" the concept of class, even if she could never get it for herself as class wasn't the type of possession one achieved through the acquisitiveness Alexis understood. So she knew enough about it to know she didn't have it, which only fueled her efforts at overcompensation by draping herself in so much sapphire and sarcasm that it kind of mesmerizing

Excellent description.

because the only way Alexis could kill Krystle's qualities was by killing Krystle herself

And that's why I think she was the most devilish soap villain. Well, she and Jacqueline Perrault.

 

[Spooky Owl!]

Hmm, I wish the writing had been a little more clever, but I liked the way Alexis was, her wicked ways mostly driven by emotion. If she wanted to fight, there was going to be a fight.

Right, but I still think we realize that the balance was off a bit in the writing for Alexis: they basically showed her winning repeatedly for no reason. Her tantrums and bluster were an important part of her appeal, but we never were convinced she could balance her checkbook, except perhaps in Season 9 when they showed she actually couldn't balance her checkbook! LOL

And that's why I think she was the most devilish soap villain. Well, she and Jacqueline Perrault.

Yes, in our expanded version of the FC narrative, Jacqueline was the soap mother to end all soap mothers. But didn't her villainy mostly arise from some degree of skillful manipulation?

Alexis had Jacqueline's narcissism, and the pretense of Jacqueline's and Sable's sophistication, but mostly Alexis was all pearl necklaces. As it were.

Sure, Sable, Abby and Jacqueline all slept with powerful men, sometimes evil men, to acquire the goodies, just like Alexis. But it's hard to imagine Sable, Abby or Jacqueline sitting around the beach on Isle of Kauai with a mai tai, almost penniless for two decades, slithering from one thatched hut to another in search of pocket change from her pavilion suitors, waiting until her ex-husband finally killed their son's gay lover so she could return to Colorado and begin extracting resources.

I mean, if Cecil was that nuts over her, why didn't she collar him years before she did? Or that bogus king in Moldavia with the American accent? It's almost like it didn't really cross her mind until she came back to Denver to testify and suddenly remembered she'd once been really, really rich.

But once a ho always a ho, I guess. No matter the bank balance.

And while that brazen earthiness made Alexis fun, without question, we still needed to see some semblance of scheming beyond what we got in Season 2 (which was effective). Which is why I always tend to view Alexis as DYNASTY's equivalent of Kristen Shepard -- all sass and big hair. Only Alexis managed to avoid getting pushed thru a balcony railing -- at least until the end, when even that happened.

 

[Werewillie Oleson]

Her tantrums and bluster were an important part of her appeal, but we never were convinced she could balance her checkbook

Yeah, for the most part, Colbyco always seemed the most stable, untouchable company, but we never knew why.

But didn't her villainy mostly arise from some degree of skillful manipulation?

And a grim determination, and a very very black heart. And she masked it so well whenever she acted as Cole and Vicky's charming and frivolous grandma!

Only Alexis managed to avoid getting pushed thru a balcony railing -- at least until the end, when even that happened.

Ha-ha!

But I wonder, was Angela Channing the most multifaceted soap villain?
Like Abby, she was quite indifferent towards her business rivals (the Gioberti's). She tried every trick in the book to drive them out of the valley, but not necessarily because she hated them.
If Chase had said in season 3 "I give up, you can have my part of Falcon Crest", she would kiss him on the cheek and wish him a bon voyage.
And then of course she'd say to Philip "I told you, he doesn't have the stomach for it".
Her hatred of Richard was based on what he was: Douglas and Jacqueline's bastard, like JR hated Pam for being a Barnes.
And like Blake Carrington Season 1, she could be at her most menacing to the people closest to her, the ones she was supposed to love: her daughters and grandson.
The way she manipulated and humiliated them was downright disgusting.

 

[Spooky Owl!]

But I wonder, was Angela Channing the most multifaceted soap villain?

In a sense she was. The others were scheming, stylish temptresses. While Angela was just a "f**k you" business woman.

 

[Gabriel Maxwell]

Yeah, for the most part, Colbyco always seemed the most stable, untouchable company, but we never knew why.

I have to say it's great when, in season 9, Colbyco finally begins to fall apart at the seams and we realize it's been going on for quite a while (though Alexis' distraction and Sean's crooked management seem to be the culprit, rather than Alexis' ineptitude since taking the reigns 6 years prior), and a brilliant and well-played character like Fritz Heath adds depth to it. But then, I've always loved the feud between Sable and Alexis in season 9 and the collapse of Colbyco was a fine layer of that feud.

 

[JROG]

OK, lovely convo but we're getting into spoilers now.....

 

[Spooky Owl!]

In a sense she was. The others were scheming, stylish temptresses. While Angela was just a "keep you" business woman.

Somehow, I just can't remember typing "k-e-e-p"...

 

[Alexis]

Somehow, I just can't remember typing "k-e-e-p"...

Every time I used a swear word in some threads it came up as Lemon. That's not even a four letter word.

 

[JROG]

Somehow, I just can't remember typing "k-e-e-p"...

LMAO and I was so confused when I read that initially. I had already forgotten the F word -- -- apparently isn't allowed anymore. Why do we have to do that childish censorship stuff? I hate it when boards censor.

 

[Alexis]

LMAO and I was so confused when I read that initially. I had already forgotten the F word -- -- apparently isn't allowed anymore. Why do we have to do that childish censorship stuff? I hate it when boards censor.

I know... I don't do it all the time but sometimes you just need the F word. And Lemon wont do.