Marvel Watching the Marvel Cinematic Universe from the beginning...

[Mel O'Drama]

As bold as the MCU has been from the beginning, it's a retro-weakness that Black Widow and Hawkeye were sidelined as secondary characters. From the beginning, I thought it was odd that they didn't launch with Ant-Man and the Wasp, if it was thought Natasha and Clint weren't strong enough characters.

Having Ant-Man and Wasp would also have echoed the original line-up from the comics which might have been a nice touch.

I know what you mean about Natasha and Clint being sidelined. They were the only two of the original MCU Avengers not introduced in their own films - both began as supporting players in other franchises - and I suppose that puts them on the back foot to begin with. From the little I've seen I get the sense that both are very popular characters with the audience and it's surprising that it took this long for them to get their own vehicles.

the extremely broad Red Guardian, in particular, felt like he wandered in from another movie.

Definitely. If there's one character I'd want removed from the film it's this one. He just didn't work for me at all.

There's been a slight feeling through much of Phase Four of it being built by tearing down the earlier phases. Whether it's the Infinity Stones being played as a gag in LOKI, or Loki himself being sidelined and treated like a buffoon in his own series, or here Yelena (admittedly, good naturedly) mocking Natasha, there's been a vague but recurring feeling of scorn towards what came before.

Interesting, and I certainly agree with this based on the examples you've given. I'll try to bear this in mind as I continue watching Phase Four.

This will pop up again in subsequent MCU entries and also what I'll be able to talk about more fully after HAWKEYE.

I'm really looking forward to Hawkeye now, and it seems there'll be lots to discuss when I get there.


I did briefly consider skipping What If...? entirely or watching it further down the line since by very definition it's non-canon. But if the MCU has taught me anything it's that there are often little Easter eggs to enjoy from watching them in order so I'll bite the bullet. That leaves the question of whether I watch Shang-Chi after Episode Four (in strict release date order) or watch the entire first What If...? season first. I'm open to suggestions.

 

[Crimson]

I did briefly consider skipping What If...? entirely or watching it further down the line since by very definition it's non-canon.

Funny you would ask, since I literally just watched it last night. When it was released, I was indifferent about the subject matter since, I figured, it would be at best peripheral to canon. I watched a couple episodes and, well, I didn't like it. In fact, there's an episode on early that I hated. I quit watching. Knowing you'd be coming up on it, I gave it another go. Still hated that episode and still turned it off, but I moved on. To my surprise, the rest was better.

WHAT IF ... ? does tie into something else in Phase Four, more than I expected, but it doesn't matter at all if you watch it before or after SHANG CHI. The connection to WHAT IF ... ? hasn't even been released yet, so you can watch this series basically whenever.

 

[Mel O'Drama]

I watched a couple episodes and, well, I didn't like it. In fact, there's an episode on early that I hated. I quit watching. Knowing you'd be coming up on it, I gave it another go. Still hated that episode and still turned it off, but I moved on. To my surprise, the rest was better.

That's good to know. I'll consider myself forewarned and that bit of hope it will make it easier to persevere if I struggle with it early on.

WHAT IF ... ? does tie into something else in Phase Four, more than I expected, but it doesn't matter at all if you watch it before or after SHANG CHI. The connection to WHAT IF ... ? hasn't even been released yet, so you can watch this series basically whenever.

Thanks for this.

(And how intriguing).

 

[Mel O'Drama]

What If…? (2021)

What If… Captain Carter Were The First Avenger? / What If… T’Challa Became A Star Lord​

As mentioned, I considered giving this one a miss. An animated series whose events aren’t part of MCU canon. On paper it’s a bit like The Real Ghostbusters. I was never really a fan of the What If…? comics for similar reasons (What If Phoenix Had Not Died? was an exception. I re-read that one quite a bit). To me they seemed irrelevant because they never had any bearing on the real 616 universe and were moot before I’d even opened them up.

That said, the MCU has been pretty good at tying things together, and with every project to date under my belt it made sense to watch now, so I can appreciate the references and have an understanding of the characters.

The animated format is certainly a change. It does make things feel a little less “official”, but that works for this premise. I suspect in production terms it’s cheaper and makes logistics easier: the MCU actors can each record separately at a convenient time and place, and those they can’t get (Chris Evans most notably) can be recast less jarringly. I am impressed with the familiar names from the films in the credits, by the way.

I did initially think animation would probably be more time-consuming, but I suspect live-action series have a lot of effects added later which possibly takes at least as long. So it’s win-win for the creators.

Pleasingly, the animation looks very nice. It’s like a hybrid of 21st Century Disney with nods to earlier atmospheric animated series such as the 1940s Fleischer/Famous Studios Superman shorts or Batman: The Animated Series. I love the shadows and backlighting effects - especially in the Captain Carter episode. The essence of the actors is captured while giving them a little animated sparkle (loved seeing Nebula with her sexy Opal Luna Saturnyne peek-a-boo hairdo).

The series has highlighted why comics and animated series frequently use distinctive costumes. Some of the characters with more low-key costumes are difficult to distinguish. When Peggy “arrived” in the 21st Century at the end of her episode, I was surprised to see that “Bucky’s" arm wasn’t metallic. It’s only on reading up afterwards I realised that it’s because it was Hawkeye rather than Bucky.

So far it’s a fun ride, albeit without any real sense of event. I’ve enjoyed seeing some of the same notes hit as the films but with a twist, as well as little in-jokes (such as Bucky telling Peggy "you almost ripped my arm off"). With the Forties setting, I noted a few little anachronisms. Peggy talking about how good it felt to being noticed and heard in particular felt rooted in 21st Century sensibilities. But there's been nothing that's been offensively offputting. I haven’t hated either episode, though I did far prefer the classy look and moody atmosphere of the Peggy episode.

I’ll incorporate the series as a whole into my rankings at the end of Season One, but since they’re all diverse subjects - and since I do like a list - I’ll have a go at ranking the episodes individually as I watch:

1. What If… Captain Carter Were The First Avenger?
2. What If… T’Challa Became A Star Lord?

 

[Crimson]

Like you, I am not particularly wild about "What If ..." or "Elseworld" style alternative fiction. They inevitably feel inconsequential, a fictional version of an already fictional story. They also inevitably trigger certain pet peeves of mine, which was very much the case with the first two episodes here.

I'll start with the good. The animation is top notch. The not-quite-traditional, not-quite-CGI, slightly retroscoping look of the animation took me a bit to adjust to, but it's extremely well done and distinctive. Animation is also much more freeing to the superhero genre. I have long maintained that superhero fiction works best in animation. While the improvements of CGI have slowly narrowed that gap, there's no such thing as "excessive animation"; but too much or inferior CGI can definitely be distracting. There are stories in this series that, in live action, would have been CGI overload and without a staggeringly large budget almost certainly unconvincing.

The voice work across the board is excellent. It's genuinely impressive that so many of the MCU actors have returned; a testament to their dedication to the franchise as well as, presumably, Disney's deep pockets. Those characters who have been recast were handled well, with no replacement voice being jarring (and one, upcoming, that I prefer over the original!)

Onto the individual episodes. I thought the Captain Carter episode was fine, but hit one of my recurring pet peeves: not enough imagination. All too often, these alternative timeline stories don't show enough creativity. A woman superhero in the 1940s and all they could come up with is a distaff version of THE FIRST AVENGER? Pfft. And, really, it was fine for what it was, but confirmed my suspicion that this series was going to be inconsequential and unimaginative.

And then I hated the second episode. Continuing on with the lack of imagination, having T'Challa somehow end up with Quill's exact codename, outfit and exact scenario was kind of lazy, blurring the lines between destiny and free will. Or, to put it another way, when you change the variable of an equation, the outcome is unlikely to be the same. But, I acknowledge this is something I just overthink and I could have pushed past it. And then there was the "let's piss on Phases One through Three" -- the ridiculous notion that T'Challa, in a different scenario, could have averted the whole thing. And if that wasn't bad enough, they turned him into an insufferably smug dick in the process. When I realized I was clenching my teeth, I turned it off. Twice. Maybe the episode swerved, maybe it redeemed itself. Don't know, don't care. Hated it.

Fairly obvious where my ranking of the episodes stand, so I'll do my list when there are more to list.

 

[Mel O'Drama]

Animation is also much more freeing to the superhero genre. I have long maintained that superhero fiction works best in animation. While the improvements of CGI have slowly narrowed that gap, there's no such thing as "excessive animation"; but too much or inferior CGI can definitely be distracting. There are stories in this series that, in live action, would have been CGI overload and without a staggeringly large budget almost certainly unconvincing.

Along similar lines, I recall thinking that something felt a little strange with Thanos in the second episode. And then it struck me: what was "strange" was that he fitted in better because - rather than an animated Thanos interacting with live actors - it was all animated. That's worked in the series' favour for me. I can't complain that something looks too fake and animated if that's by design.

Those characters who have been recast were handled well, with no replacement voice being jarring (and one, upcoming, that I prefer over the original!)

That sounds promising, and I'm sure you'll let me know when I get there. Unless I guess it first!

A woman superhero in the 1940s and all they could come up with is a distaff version of THE FIRST AVENGER? Pfft. And, really, it was fine for what it was, but confirmed my suspicion that this series was going to be inconsequential and unimaginative.

I think I cut them some slack on this level because it was the first episode. Having something that felt this familiar worked for me to acclimatise to this alternative format and was preferable for me than something a bit more out there.

Continuing on with the lack of imagination, having T'Challa somehow end up with Quill's exact codename, outfit and exact scenario was kind of lazy, blurring the lines between destiny and free will. Or, to put it another way, when you change the variable of an equation, the outcome is unlikely to be the same.

Yes, that all makes sense. I suppose with the What If...? series I've gone in with the mindset that I'll accept pretty much anything because none of it actually matters that much in the great scheme of things, and that's probably helped me enjoy it.

And then there was the "let's piss on Phases One through Four" -- the ridiculous notion that T'Challa, in a different scenario, could have averted the whole thing. And if that wasn't bad enough, they turned him into an insufferably smug dick in the process.

Yes. I suppose they were trying to show T'Challa with Peter Quill's persona. Again, I accepted it simply by virtue of my lack of investment.

Maybe the episode swerved, maybe it redeemed itself. Don't know, don't care. Hated it.

If you do ever get to watch the end (which I'm guessing won't be anytime soon), you may or may not be rewarded with another couple of MCU actor cameos plus a recast.

 

[Mel O'Drama]

Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

​

And the award for Longest Title In The Marvel Cinematic Universe Award goes to…



Circumstances meant I had some time to spare to watch a 2+ hour film last night, so - with some flexibility about how and when I watch What If…? - I bumped Shang-Chi up a little.

Shang-Chi is one of the Marvel characters with whom I’m pretty unfamiliar. I may have read a couple of his crossover appearances in other titles, but I wasn’t particularly interested. The martial arts craze didn’t particularly appeal to me* and Bruce Lee - while much talked about by classmates at school - mostly went under my radar. Characters like Shang-Chi and - to a lesser extent - Iron Fist felt to me like a different genre from my usual comics and I suppose I drew a line in the sand there.

This film could have gone either way for me, then. Since I know next to nothing about the character, there are no expectations and it’s a blank slate.

The first thing to say is that I applaud the film for using fluent Chinese-speaking actors, and for presenting us with lengthy sequences which are in Chinese. It works really well.

As the first ten minutes went on, however, I did fear the film was going to be an ersatz Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon. With the meeting and initial face-off between Xu Wenwu and Ying Li it looked as though it was heading in that direction.

As it was, the balance was good, and one aspect of this film to impress me - most of the time - was the wonderful choreography of the fight sequences. I loved the grace and speed. I’m not sure if any of these were “sweetened” with CGI (other than some floating grass, different backdrops and removing harnesses and wires from view), but if they were it’s well done. Shang-Chi had perhaps the most visually interesting action sequences because it came from a place of physical reality. The sequence on the scaffolding outside the high rise was exhilarating for its speed (its energy reminded me very much of Spider-Man, in the best possible way). It’s a great example of a scene that has a lot going on without crossing the line into meaningless visual noise in the way some of the Avengers fight scenes did.

The only action sequence I didn’t care for was the final one with its CGI beasts and glowing rings, though by now it’s certainly to be expected in the last act of an MCU film where the most obvious way to raise the stakes is to throw everything into the mix. Even this had its moments, since it stopped to get back to character and story with the conversation between Shang-Chi and his father.

The settings were gorgeous, and when the pimped-up vehicle arrived in a pastoral land filled with mythical creatures I couldn’t help thinking of those first dinosaur scenes in Jurassic Park.

The writing was decent and I appreciated the layers seen in some earlier MCU films where viewer loyalties and expectations shift as the story progresses. This was particularly true of Xu Wenwu, who felt very layered with his motives unclear and his status as an antagonist dependent on where in the story we were. This was appreciated, especially since other antagonists were of the dull “henchman” variety. Razor Fist felt very much like IM2’s Whiplash, which is not a good thing.

I’d describe most other performances as serviceable. All were watchable, with some nice touching and funny moments (the latter mostly from Katy, the obligatory smart-mouthed sidekick). As individual characters very few of the key players - including lead actor Simu Liu - grabbed me as exciting or unique characters. In some ways it feels like it’s all been seen before. But they all played their respective parts well in carrying the story so it felt like a true ensemble, and I’m sure some will feel more essential to the MCU as things go along.

continued…


​

* My exception to my almost martial art-less childhood was the Monkey TV series, which I knew at the time was terrible but I was drawn in by the funky theme song and the general weirdness of the whole thing, right down to some hilarious (and possibly offensive) dubbing.

 

[Mel O'Drama]

Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings

continued…​

Shang-Chi brings two long-forgotten and arguably quite divisive characters back to the MCU. Well, they were certainly unpopular with me.

Firstly, and most importantly, there’s Ben Kingsley’s Trevor Slattery. In Iron Man 3, I was none too impressed, calling Slattery “an irritating little milquetoast” and observing that:

Ben Kingsley has never been more wasted in a film role. I could barely look at him as I felt vicariously embarrassed.

I have to say I’m absolutely amazed anyone involved wanted to revive Trevor. After his previous appearance I’d hoped never to see him again and with eight (real world) years passing between Iron Man 3 and Shang-Chi I’d have felt pretty safe (if I’d given the character another thought at all. Which I haven’t, really).

And yet, when he appeared on-screen in Shang-Chi, I felt surprisingly happy to see him. Despite all evidence suggesting I shouldn’t be thrilled, I found myself experiencing something akin to a fond nostalgia.

This is where I wished I’d caught up on the Marvel One-Shots, since I understand one of them is devoted to Trevor post IM3, and that would have served to fill in some gaps. As it stands, I can barely remember how things were left at the end of his previous film.

Was he the best thing in the film? Far from it. Has Ben Kingsley had better film roles? No question. Would the film have been as good had he not appeared? Debatable. But it’s certain that I found him far more endearing here than before. Ben Kingsley deadpans wonderfully through some hilarious dialogue in which Slattery unwittingly reveals his lack of worldliness while thinking he’s doing the opposite:

Nineteen Sixty Eight. Planet Of The Apes. I was sitting at the cinema next to my Mum watching mastery unfold before my very eyes. After the film I asked her “How to they get those monkeys to do those things? An’ she patted me on the head an’ she said “It’s not real, pet. It’s just acting.” That’s when I knew. If they can teach those monkeys to act that brilliantly, just imagine what I could bring to the world.

So you became an actor because you thought the monkeys were actually…

Riding horses. I did! Yes. When, in fact, they were simply acting as if they were riding horses. I still can’t get my head round it to be honest.

It’s a simple moment, pitched perfectly to become one of the film’s most memorable and funny. I'm happy that this film has allowed me to gain a fonder view of the character... even if it's only a little.

His appearance here was also important since it featured the real Mandarin. And this detail enriches the earlier film. It will certainly add a new layer to mentions of him if I ever rewatch IM3.

Controversial returnee #2 is a cameo from none other than the Abomination, last seen in The Incredible Hulk some thirteen years earlier. In such a brief role he’s fine. What I most enjoyed about his appearances is that - along with some recent appearances by Thunderbolt Ross - it further ties the earlier film into the MCU proper. For a long time it seemed as though The Incredible Hulk was destined to be the runt of the MCU litter, unloved and kept out of the fold. I like to think it’s finally being recognised as an important moment in the history of the MCU. It was, after all, the first MCU film to feature a crossover appearance tying it in with the film before it. While the Abomination is unlikely to ever become a favourite of mine, it will be good to hopefully see Tim Roth back onscreen later in the year.


This is the first film to feature both Abomination and Mark Ruffalo’s Bruce Banner - though not together. Ruffalo gets a mid-credit cameo with Brie Larson. And Benedict Wong pops up a few times which is good.

Similar to Phase One to Three's Tesseract and Infinity Stones, Phase Four continues to obsessively remind us that there’s a multiverse. Which is fine, I suppose, though I can’t stop thinking that going down this road has potential to make things not only messier but also ultimately less meaningful. After all, DC’s original Crisis happened for a very good reason.

 

[Mel O'Drama]

Enter the dragon:

1. Captain America: Civil War
2. Captain America: The Winter Soldier
3. Captain America: The First Avenger
4. Iron Man
5. Avengers: Endgame
6. Black Panther
7. The Incredible Hulk
8. Thor
9. Spider-Man: Homecoming
10. WandaVision
11. Captain Marvel
12. Spider-Man: Far From Home
13. Ant-Man
14. Black Widow
15. The Falcon And The Winter Soldier
16. Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings
17. Avengers: Infinity War
18. The Avengers
19. Ant-Man And The Wasp
20. Doctor Strange
21. Guardians Of The Galaxy Vol. 2
22. Loki
23. Guardians Of The Galaxy
24. Avengers: Age Of Ultron
25. Thor: The Dark World
26. Iron Man 2
27. Thor: Ragnarok
28. Iron Man 3

 

[Crimson]

I don't have much to say about SHANG CHI. I think it's the most mid-tier of the entire MCU. I have no specific complaints about it, but also nothing about it that particularly blew me away. Perhaps that's because I've only seen it once; it's possible I will have more opinions on subsequent viewings. But, I enjoyed it and I don't expect much else from 2 hours of entertainment.

After being disappointed by the end of WANDAVISION, hating TF&WS, and being underwhelmed by LOKI and BLACK WIDOW, thinking SHANG CHI was perfectly adequate was a step up; but also hadn't done much to improve my sourness towards Phase Four.

1. Captain America: The Winter Soldier
2. Guardians of the Galaxy vol 1
3. Captain America: Civil War
4. Thor: Ragnarok
5. Avengers: Infinity War
6. The Avengers
7. Avengers: Endgame
8. Iron Man
9. Captain America: The First Avenger
10. Spider-Man: Homecoming
11. WandaVision
12. Black Panther
13. Spider-Man: Far From Home
14. Doctor Strange
15. Avengers: Age of Ultron
16. Guardians of the Galaxy vol 2
17. Shang Chi and the Legend of the Ten Rings
18. Thor
19. The Incredible Hulk
20. Ant-Man
21. Black Widow
22. Ant-Man and The Wasp
23. Loki
24. Captain Marvel
25. Iron Man 3
26. Iron Man 2
27. The Falcon and The Winter Soldier
28. Thor: The Dark World

Updated: MCU Ratings on Google Sheets

 

[Mel O'Drama]

Updated: MCU Ratings on Google Sheets

Cripes. Shang-Chi has a 98% Audience Rating on RT - the highest of any MCU project so far. And the third highest score on IMDb after Endgame and... Loki?

Some of these results are surprising to say the least.

 

[Crimson]

Of course, those scores don't really mean much; but within that meaninglessness there are certain trends to consider. That 98% rating is for Verified users -- people who proved they saw it. People who pay for a movie and go through the effort to verify a review are more inclined to be a fan and thus more likely to rate it positively. The all audience score -- people who have since seen the movie on Disney + or DVD -- is 94%. And then it's worth considering that SHANG CHI is a very new movie and only has 25,000+ reviews. In comparison, WINTER SOLIDER has 250,000+ reviews and, over time, its user score has dropped from 94% to 92%.

Also, this: Movies are scoring higher and higher on Rotten Tomatoes — but why?

 

[Mel O'Drama]

That 98% rating is for Verified users -- people who proved they saw it. People who pay for a movie and go through the effort to verify a review are more inclined to be a fan and thus more likely to rate it positively.

Yes, that all makes perfect sense.

And then it's worth considering that SHANG CHI is a very new movie and only has 25,000+ reviews. In comparison, WINTER SOLIDER has 250,000+ reviews and, over time, its user score has dropped from 94% to 92%.

This, too, all adds up. And I suppose the higher the user score the higher expectations might be which means people are harsher on it for not meeting them.

Also, this

Interesting. Thanks for this.

 

[Mel O'Drama]

What If…?


What If… The World Lost Its Mightiest Heroes?​

It’s difficult for me to be critical of this series because if the story fails I can fall back on enjoying the aesthetics. The Avengers, as presented here, look great.

It’s interesting to see them almost reverse-engineered: they’re animated versions of real life actors playing comic book characters, and it feels as though it contains the best of both worlds. Seeing these still recognisably based on the actors but also in most cases as accurate visual representations of their comic book counterparts shows how right the films have got it. Natasha’s rarely looked better.

The down side of this is that it does seem slightly jarring if an actor doesn’t look like their comic book character. An animated Bruce Banner modelled on Mark Ruffalo just looked odd to me. Ruffalo’s Bruce has simply never felt right, and this live action to comic version reinforced a key reason (though by no means the only one).

It felt a bit wrong, too, to see Ruffalo’s iteration of Bruce retconned into scenes based on The Incredible Hulk. But glass half full, it’s also great to see Betty Ross return to the MCU thirteen years on. Even though Betty, like Bruce has been recast, acknowledgement that the character exists feels more meaningful off the back of watching Shang-Chi where I was pleased to see IH characters becoming more fully integrated into the MCU. Once again, Thunderbolt Ross returns.

The “greatest hits” theme continues from the previous two episodes, with alternative views of scenes from several early MCU films (The Incredible Hulk; Iron Man 2; Thor) with comfortingly familiar settings. The Isabela’s Diner scene between Coulson and Nick Fury was a favourite. It was moody and atmospheric, and reminded me of The Consultant One-Shot (I’m not sure if it was meant to be the same diner, but given the time in which both were set I’d say there’s a good likelihood).

The plot itself was fine, I suppose. It’s good to see “bad” Hank Pym as Yellowjacket given that character’s slightly chequered history. Regarding the motivation, if Hope joining S.H.I.E.L.D. was mentioned earlier in the episode I missed it, so that aspect felt like a bit of a cheat. All the same I enjoyed reviewing the incidents from earlier in the episode and seeing how Hank had been behind them all.

Once again, a good number of MCU actors appear. A couple of recasts, but again they weren’t too jarring. Even though I was fairly sure Scarlett Johansen wasn’t voicing Natasha, the voice used here felt closer to how I’d imagined Natasha to sound when reading comics, so it was done well.

 

[Crimson]

Regarding the motivation, if Hope joining S.H.I.E.L.D. was mentioned earlier in the episode I missed it, so that aspect felt like a bit of a cheat.

And that is adjacent to one of my pet peeves about these kinds of stories and honestly just fiction in general: writers who create a "rule" for their world and then cheat against it.

To build on that, let's consider what WHAT IF ... ? is portraying. In comics, as a I recall, the "What If ...?" tales were not meant to be parallel universes or divergent timelines; they were just random concepts of things that could have happened. In the MCU, divergent timelines have become a significant plot point (END GAME; LOKI). We also know the Multiverse is about to be explored, as it's literally in the title of an upcoming movie. What we don't know: are divergent timelines and parallel universes the same? For now, I am going to assume they are. The alternative is that there is a multitude of universes each with a multitude of timelines; that gives me headache.

That detour was relevant because a divergent timeline starts when a specific event deviates from the norm, thus creating the new timeline/universe. With that, I can't help but judge each of these tales on how well they establish that divergent point and how well they follow through on it. The Captain Carter episode was fine in that regards; the T'Challa as Starlord had a decent starting point but flimsy follow through.

To your point, I'm not sure if there was a mention/hint of Hope having joined S.H.I.E.L.D. If not, I agree that's something of a narrative cheat. But I would also have to view that as the divergent point for this timeline: Hope was recruited by S.H.I.E.L.D., then was killed in action, then Hank went nuts. A bit convoluted, but I guess it works. How well this fits into the MCU as a divergent point is less clear. I recall Hope being quite resentful at her parents' careers, which makes it dubious that she would have followed in their paths. And then, the cheat; if Hank's goal was the kill the Avengers before they formed, there was no reason for him to kill Thor. We, the audience, of course knew who he was, but neither Fury nor Pym had any reason to. But I can give it a pass since Hank was insane and, thus, probably not prone to rational decisions. (I recall someone complaining that Thanos' plot didn't make sense, to which someone replied "They didn't call him the Sane Titan".)

So this episode mostly passed the sniff test, and beyond that I enjoyed it. As mysteries go, it was decent even if I had the Pym angle worked out at least halfway through.

1. "What If... the World Lost Its Mightiest Heroes?"
2. "What If... Captain Carter Were the First Avenger?"
3. "What If... T'Challa Became a Star-Lord?"

 

[Angela Channing]

People who pay for a movie and go through the effort to verify a review are more inclined to be a fan and thus more likely to rate it positively.

I agree but I think the opposite is also true. If you pay to see a film and hate it that will motivate you to leave a negative review whether you are a fan of a film series or not. What these reviews aggregators are bad in capturing is the "meh" crowd: people who think a film is just ok but no more.

 

[Mel O'Drama]

In comics, as a I recall, the "What If ...?" tales were not meant to be parallel universes or divergent timelines; they were just random concepts of things that could have happened.

That's how I remember it, although some were based on the concept of a canonical story taking a different turn and affecting events after that point (my oft-read What If Phoenix Hadn't Died? springs to mind).

In the MCU, divergent timelines have become a significant plot point (END GAME; LOKI). We also know the Multiverse is about to be explored, as it's literally in the title of an upcoming movie.

I'm really trying to keep an open mind around this, but I don't feel particularly invested in the concept. Endgame did it brilliantly, and it's right that such an important story should have some effect on future films. I was also OK with it in Loki since it was a different medium and gave that series a USP. But I suppose I'm of a mind that the on-screen universe created in the MCU is interesting enough and - strange as it may sound for this genre - it seems too sci-fi to truly appeal. It almost fits into the category you mentioned of fiction creating its own rules and then breaking them.

I'm not sure if there was a mention/hint of Hope having joined S.H.I.E.L.D. If not, I agree that's something of a narrative cheat. But I would also have to view that as the divergent point for this timeline: Hope was recruited by S.H.I.E.L.D., then was killed in action, then Hank went nuts. A bit convoluted, but I guess it works.

Yes, that worked for me as well. Though, with the same reservations you said about.

 

[Mel O'Drama]

What If…?



What If… Doctor Strange Lost His Heart Instead Of His Hands?
/ What If… Zombies!?​

The Doctor Strange episode feels like the equivalent of The Incredible Hulk film (and the early MCU overall) where the first two thirds blew me away, only for me to change my mind with the final battle. Here, as there, the episode felt very bipolar.

Doctor Strange has a great premise and is written incredibly well. There’s also some good stuff going on with the combination of animation and voice acting. I found myself very invested and, as the story - somewhere between Dr Faustus and Back To The Future - unfolded this became my favourite to date.

Had it been seven or eight minutes shorter and written around the inevitable tedious battle between Stranges, there’s no doubt this would have taken the #1 spot for me. However, the last ten minutes or so are probably the least-watchable ten minutes of the What If…? series to date for me. It’s the first time I’ve felt bored and restless watching, checking the clock and sighing while waiting for the episode to end.

Despite my issues with the multiverse mentioned above, the concept works in a series of this nature. I loved the exploration of Christine’s death as an Absolute Point in time. The two Doctor Stranges facing off was less appealing to me, though my biggest gripe was with the execution rather than the concept.

This is the longest episode so far, but it felt so much longer than it actually was.



Oh, how my heart sank at the idea of a zombie episode. While I commend the concept (mostly) pushing things further away from simply re-enacting moments from films with a different outcome, this is never going to be a story that invested me greatly. Zombies simply aren’t my thing.

The characters were an interesting mix, with many of them not having interacted with one another a great deal on-screen in the MCU (or not at all in at least a couple of cases). However, some of them seemed a bit pointless. I had to look up Kurt’s name after the episode to see who he was. I’d half convinced myself he was created just for this episode, so much did he blend into the background in the Ant-Man films.

Scott’s head in the jar made me think of Futurama, and then I couldn’t stop seeing similarities between that series and What If…?, which helped a little.

The episode was more watchable than I’d expected. This isn’t saying a great deal, but it is at least best case scenario. There were some moments that headed towards being almost touching, and at least in this universe there was an Uncle Ben.

 

[Mel O'Drama]

1. "What If... the World Lost Its Mightiest Heroes?"
2. "What If... Captain Carter Were the First Avenger?"
3. "What If... T'Challa Became a Star-Lord?"

I forgot to rank after the third episode, but my list would have been identical to yours at that point.

Here's how it's looking after another two:

1. What If… The World Lost Its Mightiest Heroes?
2. What If… Captain Carter Were The First Avenger?
3. What If… Doctor Strange Lost His Heart Instead Of His Hands?
4. What If… T’Challa Became A Star Lord?
5. What If… Zombies!?

 

[Crimson]

What If… Doctor Strange Lost His Heart Instead Of His Hands?

My reaction to this one was the flip of yours. I found it difficult to get past the entry of this one, and found myself so distracted by the "divergent point" and whether or not it worked, that I was barely paying attention. Now I haven't seen DOCTOR STRANGE in a number of years, so perhaps I am misremembering, but I recall Strange and Christine met after his accident. And, despite the fact that she was obviously the obligatory "love interest" in the film, I don't recall them having any great chemistry that would lead me to believe she was the love of his life. (I'm hoping the MCU introduces Clea.) I suppose the divergent point here is that they met earlier and fell in love. So, like the Hope van Dyne plot point, this seems awfully cumbersome and, for me, even less convincing. Since I didn't buy the motivation for Strange turning "evil", I was simply not that invested in the story. Not until it turned into a phantasmagoria of mystical action did my interest pique, and even then mostly to ponder how this stuff is much better in animation than "live action" CGI.

What If… Zombies!?

Like you, I am wildly unenthusiastic about zombie fiction. I find them to be, at best, tedious as "monsters" and often excessively gross. I haven't read comic books in ages, but I pay peripheral attention to what's happening in the industry. Few things seem odder to me than Marvel & DC sharing an apparent obsession with zombiefying their characters. This one also had a few mental hurdles I struggled with. I'm not crazy about when a character we know in the "real" universe will do something completely heinous and "out of character" in an alternate tale. Also I found myself pondering how consistent the portrayals of zombies are here: the "normal" zombies are all lumbering, mindless corpses, but the hero zombies all kept their skills and powers? I'm not sure it's a "cheat", but it seemed a bit iffy; unless a zombie accountant could still do your taxes.

Yet, despite starting with more reservations on my part than the previous episodes, this is the first story that I became entirely engrossed by. I just stopped thinking about all those nagging questions and concerns and got swept into the story. I found it grim without being gross, and liked the ragtag band of unexpected heroes working together.

1. What If… Zombies!?
2. What If… The World Lost Its Mightiest Heroes?
3. What If… Captain Carter Were The First Avenger?
4. What If… Doctor Strange Lost His Heart Instead Of His Hands?
5. What If… T’Challa Became A Star Lord?